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Posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jun 23 07:34:34 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by RonInBayside on Fri Jun 23 07:01:48 2006. That's one of the worst things a parent can do to a child. Disowning someone because of whom he/she chooses to marryFalse. G-d and Judaism are more important than you. If everyone thought like you, then there wouldn't be a Jewish religion today. Stop being so damn greedy. |
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Posted by TeaBiscuit18thAveDude on Fri Jun 23 09:03:00 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by G1Ravage on Fri Jun 23 01:40:55 2006. Like giving you head lice. |
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Posted by mambomta on Fri Jun 23 13:04:20 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jun 23 07:34:34 2006. I actually have to agree with Ron on this point. I have met several people who are married to someone of a different religion. In some cases, the person has converted, in either direction, during the marriage. |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Jun 23 16:22:47 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jun 23 07:34:34 2006. I hate to admidt it too, but I also agree with Ron on this particular instance. I think it's terrible when parents do that to their kids. It doesn't just happen with religion either. I know someone who was raised Lutheran. All well and good. She met a guy who was Greek Orthodox. Her parents completely threw her out of the house because she had the "nerve" to date someone other than a protestant, much less a Greek Orthodox. This went on a year. Thankfully, her parents lightened up a bit. They eventuallyt got married, and now have three wonderful kids. It's also 12 years later.What they would have missed if not for this idiodic relgion stuff. |
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Posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 23 16:27:48 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jun 23 07:34:34 2006. Hah..look at the pot calling the kettle.Bastard. |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Fri Jun 23 22:07:25 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jun 23 07:34:34 2006. I don't know where to put a response post on this little subthread.Was it Venezula, or maybe I'm getting my country mixed up, where all the black people disappeared. They disappeared into the gene pool and everyones mixed now. It's not so far fetched for other groups too. Plus, I'd like to have something in common with someone. Perferably someone who knows where I'm coming from. Mixing may be easier in more ethnic circles or cities, Irish, Italian or whatever. You can get along with people in this situation and still have an understanding and some common issues in these cases dealing with family insanity. But someone bland from somewhere else might not get the whole ethnic thing, or gasp, may be pro "palestinian". But if I was picking a girl out of a catalog, lately I'd want someone who can at least relate to everything and understand things. To put things blandly and undetailed. Plus.....I really don't think I'll ever be able to outdrink an irish chick. A jewish girl might be a better bet. But, life is totally uncontrolled, it's hard to keep things as planned. |
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Posted by BMT Guy on Sat Jun 24 00:12:31 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jun 23 00:58:23 2006. How so? Depends on the situation... |
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Posted by BIE on Sat Jun 24 00:18:23 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jun 23 00:58:23 2006. TRA-DIT-ION, TRADITION!!!--Fiddler on the Roof 8-) |
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Posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 01:17:10 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jun 23 07:34:34 2006. G-d and Judaism are more important than you. Only to people who have been conditioned to think that by HUMANS who have declared that to be the case. It's all a bunch of mind control to put derrieres in shul and church pews and keep the Earthly money coming in order to do the work of a supernatural being who shouldn't need Earthly money to do his good deeds. If this is the case, that God and Judaism are more important than I am, then look at what these two sadistic institutions are doing to me and countless other individuals in tortiously interfering with our happiness. The "Cause." Subjugate yourself and your one spin around this world for The "Cause." If you do, then maybe (we don't know, nor will we ever) you MAY have a life of eternal bliss in the afterlife -- another artificial construct of man to control his actions in this world. If everyone thought like you, then there wouldn't be a Jewish religion today. And there would probably be world peace as Islam would also crumble once the more enlightened found that it is nothing but a crock of shit to keep you in someone else's power as well. If Judaism (or Islam, or whatever) is so important to you, then you do your part to uphold it. I, for what it's worth, don't think it is so important, and in fact, think it's downright silly. But I am still quite inextricably linked to this nonsense through my family, and it's preventing me from pursuing happiness while I can still enjoy it. I hope you never have to choose between yourself and your family over something so fucking petty. |
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Posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 01:53:18 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by RonInBayside on Fri Jun 23 07:01:48 2006. That's one of the worst things a parent can do to a child. Disowning someone because of whom he/she chooses to marry Put me down as agreeing with you as well on this point, but with one reservation. I don't think that labeling it outright as cruel is the answer, as I feel there is a great deal of latent reasoning behind it that must be overcome rather than castigated. I think the answer lies somewhere between the logic of your statement and the emotion of Brian's. As we both know, humans are neither 100% logical nor 100% emotional, and there is a good deal of benefit to be had from both properties. We live in a society becoming far more liberal (small L) in its social values. It's no longer taboo to interact with people of other groups than yourself. The direct effect of that is far greater openness in choosing a mate, having children, and the actions being openly endorsed by most everybody. The globe has become smaller, and so we have become largely closer. Not a bad thing. Anthropologically speaking, we are hard-wired toward seeking a mate with our attributes, as this is what we were used to for over 50,000 years of existence if not by desire, then definitely by default. One rarely found a mate outside a small radius of where they were born, and chances were overwhelming that those within that radius were much like yourself. It was only in the last fifty or 75 years that automobiles, much less airplanes, have made it easier for us to expand our sphere of eligible mates. The problem arises when there are those of more "traditional" values or upbringing not wishing to become a part of this changing tide. And this is quite understandable, although you or others may decry this as "racism" or "closed-mindedness." Compacted into the period of a day, we were mixing freely as a species for only about two minutes, and naturally there are many people, peoples, cultures, societies, etc. who are afraid that in the new order of things, their way of life will become subjugated if not made extinct. Racism, or self-preservation? Do you want an example of this that has nothing to do with "Western" or "White" imperialism or colonialism? Well, I recently watched a National Geographic (or otherwise Patrician science program) discussing tribes in Africa. You know, the ones with the plates in their lips and the drooping earlobes. To make a long story short, this tribe of African natives recently had a road built beside their village, opening them up to the "outside." Almost immediately, most of the women of the tribe left the village for other opportunities, eschewing the plate in the lip. Soon after, it has been decreed by the tribal leader that this practice will no longer take place within the tribe, as travelers on the road may find it odd, and bring the tribe all manner of bad publicity. To the "Save Africa" crowd, that must be a shame, although if someone laments a black and a white miscegenating in this country, or that the white race is rapidly degenerating, it's "racism." But I digress. This is a culture, primitive by any yardstick, but anthropologically significant nonetheless, that has become extinct. Does the logic of your comment extend toward the want to preserve as many anthropological distinctions as possible, regardless of their "value" or "merit" or how many children become yoked into its maintenance; or do you feel that society doesn't need any plate-lipped primitive African tribespeople and it is good that they have become assimilated into, at least, the African "mainstream?" Should the Jewish/Islamic/White/Black/Chinese/Japanese/Hindu "Causes" be maintained as anthropologically pedigree, or should all of these distinguishing characteristics and pedigrees fall by the wayside in favor of "one humanity" without any references? It's a fence I am sitting squarely and painfully between. How about you? |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Jun 24 04:34:05 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 01:17:10 2006. Basically, I respect people who believ e in their religions. That's their choice, however, religion was invented by HUMANS as mentioned.Humans made the rules, and it was passed on for generations from parent to child. People are only the religion they are because their parents told them "this is the way it is", and their parents told them that "this is the way it is", and so on. The most devout Catholic would be the most conservative Jew if that is what his/her parents taught them, and the most devout Jew would be the most devout Catholic if that is what his parents brought him up as. Like it or not, we are a product of our parents, who are a product of their parents, and so forth. |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Jun 24 04:37:24 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jun 23 00:58:23 2006. Why would that be? Sure it's not easy, but it's not being "screwed". I personally said, I find it very hard. However, I also don't feel it's wrong. People are free to make their own choices. Just because some guy cooped up in a room somewhere thousands of years ago said "this is the way it is" and wrote it down in what he called a "sacred book" doesn't mean it's correct, just because it says it's correct. |
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Posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 04:40:58 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Jun 24 04:34:05 2006. Like it or not, we are a product of our parents, who are a product of their parents, and so forth But what happens if one of the links in this chain thinks otherwise? It was brought up by its parents, who were brought up by their parents, and it sees that something about that upbringing is not right, is archaic, or is otherwise detrimental to its happiness? Read my response to RonInBayside in this subthread. I give ample voice to both sides of the debate, which I maintain isn't as clear cut as we might make it. |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Sat Jun 24 10:04:08 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 01:17:10 2006. God wants you to put a dollar in the boxah. |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jun 24 10:28:54 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by orange blossom special on Tue Jun 20 18:56:29 2006. Yeah, but you'd be hard-pressed to find a Jewess there.What's different and special about Jewish women, I'd like to know? |
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Posted by BMT Guy on Sat Jun 24 10:38:22 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Jun 24 04:37:24 2006. Gotta 'high-five' ya on that. Well said! |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jun 24 10:45:47 2006, in response to The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Mon Jun 19 17:09:52 2006. Ever try JewishSingles-JewishDating.com? The big collage on their front page might make me a believer . . . |
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Posted by BMT Guy on Sat Jun 24 10:47:34 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 01:17:10 2006. Nice, very thoughtful post....and I agree wholeheartedly! Thanks, Adam.. |
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Posted by Peter Rosa on Sat Jun 24 10:52:18 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 04:40:58 2006. Like it or not, we are a product of our parents, who are a product of their parents, and so forthBut what happens if one of the links in this chain thinks otherwise? It was brought up by its parents, who were brought up by their parents, and it sees that something about that upbringing is not right, is archaic, or is otherwise detrimental to its happiness? That does happen, frequently. Children brought up in a particular religion often drift away when they become old enough to make their own decisions. Some will convert to other religions while more will simply become non-religious. And this works the other way too, with children brough up in non-religious families turning to religion, often of the fundamentalist variety, in adulthood. The point is that religion is inherited - but only to a degree. My LIRR/NYCT blog |
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Posted by Peter Rosa on Sat Jun 24 11:05:44 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jun 24 10:45:47 2006. Ever try JewishSingles-JewishDating.com? The big collage on their front page might make me a believer . . .It's a safe bet that 99% of their female members look nothing like those shown on the collage. Nice sideboob shot on the second one from the top, left hand side. My LIRR/NYCT blog |
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Posted by R30A on Sat Jun 24 11:40:32 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by RonInBayside on Fri Jun 23 07:01:48 2006. That's one of the worst things a parent can do to a child. Disowning someone because of whom he/she chooses to marry (the asumption I am making is that the would-be spouse isn't endangering the safety of the other spouse or others).I disagree. If a parent would disown a child for a personal life choice such as religious racial or sexual preference, then the child is better off without the parent's damaging influence. (I do think we agree on the basic idea) |
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Posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 12:06:02 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Peter Rosa on Sat Jun 24 10:52:18 2006. Okay, granted. But we are talking about this phenomenon as it relates to children being disowned and excommunicated from the family as a result of their wanting to marry outside the family's religion. Suppose you have an "Alpha Child" who knows "better" than the family about the value of religion, shuns the whole crock of shit, and becomes an outcast from his family as a result. Now, the child is choosing between his own happiness and contact with his family and their happiness. A vicious predicament. What can we do to prevent that, other than yoke all children into their (misguided and archaic) faith by birth, and to hell with all others? |
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Posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 12:09:01 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by BMT Guy on Sat Jun 24 10:47:34 2006. Hey, I try. Especially when the issue means something to me directly. |
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Posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 12:13:04 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by R30A on Sat Jun 24 11:40:32 2006. Lincoln, once again you are right logically, but you try going through life estranged from your family over their petty mind control. Yes, it may be "their fault" and you might be willing to "screw" them or "stick it to them" over it, and you'd be totally in the right, but is that the way either of you wants to live life? |
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Posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 12:18:06 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jun 24 10:45:47 2006. And if you believe that, I have a bride for you. Ever hear of the term "Bait-And-Switch?" |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 18:30:05 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Jun 24 04:37:24 2006. Very nicely said. |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 18:33:01 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jun 24 10:45:47 2006. I like the second one from the top: http://www.jewishfriendfinder.com/search/p3005.subjewishdating&age=18-25&show=FLink here |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 18:34:09 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by R30A on Sat Jun 24 11:40:32 2006. You're on to something there. Yes, very astute of you. |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 18:34:55 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Jun 24 04:34:05 2006. Exactly correct! |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 18:36:42 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 01:17:10 2006. I like your post a lot. |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sat Jun 24 19:28:51 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Tue Jun 20 13:28:58 2006. Nearly 40 years ago, on Bastille Day, my wife and I had our first date. We went to Chinatown so we didn't have a Kosher meal. All marriages have ups and downs but on the whole, I believe that I made the right choice. Being the first inter-faith marriage in my family, there was a bit of resistance but I still remember my grandfather, Fred, telling me to sXXXw anyone who wasn't happy for us.The holidays never really presented any problems for us. We observed and respected each other's traditions. I suppose that there would have been problems if I wanted to keep a Kosher home, though as my wife loves shrimp etc. |
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Posted by Peter Rosa on Sat Jun 24 19:47:09 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 18:33:01 2006. I like the second one from the topIf you think a man has chance of actually meeting these chix I have a bridge to sell you. Most likely none of them are real members; the people who run the site get pictures from various sources and add fake "user" information. If "Jewish Friend Finder" is anything like the typical personals site, along the lines of Lavalife.com, E-harmony.com and Yahoo Personals, men outnumber women by at least 5x among the total membership. The few authentic women members get hundreds of responses from men, while men never hear back from any of the women they contact and indeed get nothing at all except maybe for come-ons from hookers. They can't even get solicitations from mail-order bride companies any more, now that it's illegal. My LIRR/NYCT blog |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 19:48:40 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Peter Rosa on Sat Jun 24 19:47:09 2006. I didn't say she was "real;" I just said I liked her (appearance). |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jun 24 23:35:26 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 12:18:06 2006. Bait & Switch? That's a term from AdultFriendFinder.com, ain't it? |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 23:48:03 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jun 24 23:35:26 2006. I thought bait is what you offer the lady, and switch is what she whacks it with.8-) |
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Posted by Orange Blossom Special on Sun Jun 25 01:02:11 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Peter Rosa on Sat Jun 24 11:05:44 2006. Looks like it's worth the risk to find out. |
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Posted by xtimx on Sun Jun 25 02:51:46 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Tue Jun 20 13:28:58 2006. people still care about religion?you won't love someone based on what magical fairy in the sky they believe in? |
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Posted by SilverFox on Sun Jun 25 03:07:08 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 18:36:42 2006. If you liked that post, kindly give me your opinion on this post. It seems we are opening up more questions and cans of worms than settling them. As I have mentioned, although one side may be logically correct, both sides have some merit, since man is neither 100% logical nor 100% intuitive/emotional. The trick is, how do we get those on the other side to get with the program without alienating and castigating them? |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun Jun 25 07:47:33 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by xtimx on Sun Jun 25 02:51:46 2006. You read my post wrong. I think it's all a crock of shit to tell you the truth. All of the religions. However, it does make it more difficult (because people chose religion) (not that there's anything wrong with that). |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun Jun 25 07:49:33 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 12:13:04 2006. Well stated. it's not that through "religion" that people's lives would be screwed. it's the petty mind control that people's family and religion places this burden on people and that's what stick's it to them.It's disgusting actually. it's really a crock. |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun Jun 25 08:15:09 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 01:53:18 2006. Very interesting.I suppose I could have chosen to use the word "counter-productive," which would have worked better. I like and agree with much of what you say. As to religion, well, a given religion will survive so long as it has adherents. It's concepts will survive so long as people have a memory of them or records to consult. This is why clerics understand the value of marketing. Sometimes that consists of enticing people to the religion and offering them goodies if they join (social and material); sometimes it's an appeal to base instincts of ethnicity and skin color; sometimes it's by shooting members of the other religion... |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun Jun 25 08:17:02 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by mambomta on Tue Jun 20 14:38:41 2006. Exactly. |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun Jun 25 08:26:14 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Howard Fein on Tue Jun 20 14:10:57 2006. It depends on the people involved. They will or won't make the religion work."One friend of mine, a devout Reform Jew (Yes, there is such a thing!) had an unsuccessful- and fortunately childless- nine-year marriage to an unaffiliated Jew. His relative shortness- 5'6"- and blue-collar job made him unattractive to Jewish women he met at singles' functions (that he was financially flush and of great personality meant NOTHING)" I experienced that treatment (the Jewish women disdaining me), for other reasons, in my college years and even later. This attitude was not restricted to Jews, of course. There's not much more obnoxious than this: The woman wants, preferably, a combination of Superman and Bill Gates. Nothing unreasonable - just a boatload of money, a big house, and a handsome man with a fifth-degree black belt in karate. Of course, if you pointed out to her that she, on her part, was not a classic blonde with high cheekbones, and barely filled an A-cup bra, she'd say "well, it's my personality that counts." Hypocrisy at its finest... |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun Jun 25 08:26:44 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by RonInBayside on Sun Jun 25 08:26:14 2006. Imeant to say "Would make the marriage work." |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Jun 25 11:19:37 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jun 24 23:35:26 2006. No, it is a term from retail. |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Jun 25 11:29:51 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 23 16:27:48 2006. Idiot. |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Jun 25 11:30:25 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by orange blossom special on Fri Jun 23 22:07:25 2006. But if I was picking a girl out of a catalog, lately I'd want someone who can at least relate to everything and understand things. To put things blandly and undetailed. Plus.....I really don't think I'll ever be able to outdrink an irish chick. A jewish girl might be a better bet.EXACTLY. |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Jun 25 11:32:21 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Jun 24 04:34:05 2006. however, religion was invented by HUMANS as mentioned.Humans made the rules False, G-d made the rules. |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Jun 25 11:32:57 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by RonInBayside on Sat Jun 24 18:34:55 2006. Exactly false! |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Jun 25 11:34:23 2006, in response to Re: The Jewish Woman Shortage, posted by SilverFox on Sat Jun 24 01:17:10 2006. I, for what it's worth, don't think it is so important, and in fact, think it's downright silly.That's because you don't understand it, so you label it "silly." |
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