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| Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question (567079) | |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:52:20 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:41:37 2008. I disagree. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:52:47 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:30:08 2008. Right, they put it out there so they could unwittingly charge people $5. I say - let the people walk to the middle of the parking lot to get the airtrain for free IF (and only IF) your line of thinking on this is correct, which I don't think it is.And you will still see the vast majority of people using the $5 option ndirect from the station. And really, the "free" bus (by transfer) is readily available on shorter subway ride to Lefferts Blvd A station for those cheap people. It's called the Q10. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:53:10 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:42:31 2008. No it's not. Your point is no one chooses the buses because they know better. My point is no one chooses the bus because they don't know better. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:53:48 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:32:07 2008. Lefferts A station: Q10 is the thing for you then.For people that value their time, then there's the Howard Beach station and AirTrain. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:54:09 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:43:52 2008. No. I'm sure the avg traveler who didn't do their research would assume airtrain at HB is free, as it is everywhere else in the country in the same situation. |
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Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:55:01 2008, in response to Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 18 10:35:25 2008. This is ludicrous. So have them spend the money to move the fare control area to get rid of the semantics of this lunacy. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:55:11 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:47:01 2008. then don't you dare claim the Q10 is a hell ride. I rode it and it was perfectly fine. You can't contradict that since you haven't tried it lately. |
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Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:55:40 2008, in response to Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 18 10:47:02 2008. win! |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:56:16 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:50:51 2008. Oh please. That's heresay, and I severely doubt more than a small few would do that.When have I ever lied here? |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:57:33 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:52:47 2008. And you will still see the vast majority of people using the $5 option ndirect from the station.No, I'm saying get rid of the $5 toll and let everyone off the (A) walk to the middle of the parking lot to get the free circulator. |
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Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:57:37 2008, in response to Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 18 10:40:29 2008. So have them abanon the Howard Beach Airtrain station, move it to a more convenient location (to the parking lot, as where it is now is certainly not the ideal place for serving the parking lot), take away that convenient access to the Howard Beach A station, and we can then move on from this ludicrous topic, as then the comvenient connection for the many that appreciate that is lost, but the 5 or 6 people at SubChat who always bring up this semantic argument would at least be happy. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:58:12 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:53:48 2008. No, for the people who value their time, there should be no ped toll to cross the imaginary line at HB. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Charles G on Mon Feb 18 10:58:38 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:19:20 2008. Furthermore, NO OTHER AIRPORT CHARGES TO RIDE ITS FREE CIRCULATOR FROM A RAPID TRANSIT STATION EITHER ON OR ADJACENT TO THE PROPERTY.What about SFO with BART? |
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Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:58:47 2008, in response to Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:55:01 2008. How could they do that? Charge people coming from the parking lot?!!? On a FREE AIRPORT CIRCULATOR!!?!?!? |
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| (571729) | |
Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 18 10:59:05 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun Feb 17 19:57:49 2008. Would it increase people using Airtrain? Probably not.I see you're not familiar with one of the most fundamental economic principles: When the price of something falls, demand rises. |
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Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:59:53 2008, in response to Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 10:57:37 2008. As long as the people can walk onto the airport property for free from the A. OF course this would never happen, as it is just as stupid as charing the $5 ped toll. |
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Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:01:12 2008, in response to Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 18 10:47:02 2008. Given your argument, taking the Brooklyn Bridge is toll evasion if the Battery Tunnel is the more direct route for a driver.Not at all, as those people that would use the Brooklyn Bridge instead of the Battery Tunnel would not be using the Batter Tunnel. Comparing the Brooklyn Bridge to the Batter Tunnel is like comparing AirTrain to the Q10. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:01:16 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Charles G on Mon Feb 18 10:58:38 2008. IIRC, BART charges an extra fare to get you onto the airport property (it's like a further fare zone). The airport does not charge any fare for its free circulator. |
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Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:02:08 2008, in response to Re: Crossing Imaginary Lines, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:01:12 2008. Battery. My keyboard on my laptop is getting old, so the Y didn't come out when I pressed it. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Charles G on Mon Feb 18 11:02:27 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 09:52:45 2008. LGA is operated by the Port Authority. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 18 11:08:01 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Feb 17 20:20:43 2008. And if it just shifted people away from the Jamaica branch, which would seem unlikely, at least in significant numbers, that would just prove that Chris and others are wrong when they says that no one dislikes the $5 toll to access the airport property at HB.That's not a valid conclusion. Even if people don't dislike the access fee, rational people will always choose the option which has the lowest opportunity cost. |
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| (571744) | |
Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:12:06 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:53:10 2008. No, my point is that anyone that would know better, would not be taking the bus due to AirTrains superiority over a bus to the Airport. |
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| (571745) | |
Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:12:35 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:54:09 2008. That's complete speculation. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:13:37 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:55:11 2008. Sorry, no way the Q10 is more seemless and convenient than AirTrain. It could be a Charter style bus for all I care (which obviously it's not), and it still wouldn't be the better choice. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:15:57 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:12:06 2008. But people don't know better! They are being tricked into AirTrain and paying $5! |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:16:53 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:12:35 2008. No it's not. Every other circulator is FREE. Why would they think this one isn't free????? |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Charles G on Mon Feb 18 11:17:01 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:01:16 2008. What's the difference? It's clearly a surcharge to access an otherwise free airport circulator. If you were dropped off at that station, you would pay nothing. |
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| (571753) | |
Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:17:07 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:56:16 2008. I didn't say you lied, you may have seen that recation (in fact, I believe you did, I never said "lied"). But I didn't know you live at the Howard Beach station and see this happening all the time. Unless you have access to a closed-circuit TV that you monitor all the time.One hour, day, or week (if by some chance you were there 24/7 for a week) do not make the whole picture. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:17:33 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:13:37 2008. I said don't call it a hell ride. I didn't say it was more seemless. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:17:39 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:13:37 2008. I said don't call it a hell ride. I didn't say it was more seamless. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:18:22 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:57:33 2008. Let everyone walk to the parking lot when there is a seamless connection there now? That's ludicrous, and for what, to get rid of some semantic idea? |
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Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by subfan on Mon Feb 18 11:19:00 2008, in response to Re: Air Train question, posted by metropod on Sun Feb 10 10:00:50 2008. Your second point is incorrect. Trains from Jamaica return to Jamaica and trains from HB return to HB. I take the AirTrain from Jamaica regularly, and once it hits the airport, the anouncements all say "The last stop on this train is Station D, Jamaica Station".subfan |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:19:06 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 10:58:12 2008. There isn't a toll for an imaginary line at HB. There is however a fare to ride AirTrain there. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:20:55 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 18 10:59:05 2008. Most of those people are already using AirTrain. Sure, demand at HB would rise, but a lot of those people would be coming from the E's leg, cannabalizing that. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:21:19 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Charles G on Mon Feb 18 11:17:01 2008. No it's not. They needed to extend the subway to get onto airport property. And BART has a distance based fare system, right? So you need to go further. So they charge more. But the circulator is free.If NYCT had distance based fares, and they extended the A to the terminals, then it might makes sense to charge more to ride that portion of the (A). |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:22:22 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Charles G on Mon Feb 18 11:02:27 2008. That's what I thought, so there wouldn't be a problem with an operation connecting the two AirTrains. I could see a problem with semantics though if there would be an intermediate station in between. And you really would need intermediate stations for efficiency. For those, the law may need to be changed. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:24:01 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:17:39 2008. I didn't call it a hell ride in this particular conversation. I may have in the past, but not in this conversation.Even though now that you bring it up, it is a hell ride (if comparing it to the AirTrain). |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:27:24 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:17:07 2008. Why do you need to observe all the time to prove a point? A good sample should be enough. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:28:07 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:18:22 2008. This is your idea! My idea is just to drop the stupid ped toll and everyone's happy. Pretty simple really. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:28:45 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:19:06 2008. There is no fare. A fare would apply to all. That isn't the case. There is no fare for people entering the same exact station from the parking lot. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:28:51 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:27:24 2008. I could stand there for a few hours and observe none of the activity you describe, and claim the opposite. That would be no better of subjective conclusion than you came up with. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:29:47 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:24:01 2008. It's not a hell ride. It is perfectly fine. Try it. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:30:27 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:28:51 2008. I could stand there for a few hours and observe none of the activity you describe, and claim the oppositeNo you couldn't! Because I went there and saw it! It happens a lot! |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:33:34 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:29:47 2008. No thanks, I'll spend my $4-whatever and use AirTrain. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:34:34 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:30:27 2008. Okay, yes, "Everyone" says "WTF" when they see this surprise*. Next topic.*Oh please. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:37:25 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:33:34 2008. Then it's not a hell ride since you've never tried it. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:37:56 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:34:34 2008. Not everyone. I never said everyone. I said it happens enough that you wouldn't go 10 hours and not see it. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:51:17 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:37:56 2008. So all the rest of the people in that 10 hours didn't have a problem. Good, that's just what I had thought. The majority doesn't see it as strange at all. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:53:12 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:37:25 2008. Okay fine, it's an inconvenient bus transportation avenue, as opposed to a more seamless AirTrain/subway direct rail transportation avenue. |
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Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Feb 18 11:58:20 2008, in response to Re: Diagrams Re: Air Train question, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Feb 18 11:51:17 2008. No, that's not it at all. I saw a lot of it in a sample 20 minutes. That would translate proportionally to 10 hours.Why are you saying these ridiculous things? How is this helping? |
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