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| Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga (1129753) | |
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| (1130509) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by handbrake on Sun Jan 8 14:17:16 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 13:13:07 2012. I will assume NHRR being New Haven RR? From the description of the two PO's provided, it appears that if a station was situated at 76th street, it could have never seen any revenue service based not only on its construction finish, but with no direct physical connection to the main line from Euclid. This would then raise the question of why a subway station would be built with no direct access to the main subway line? Lastly, unless the entire length of the unfinished subway were filled in completely with earthen fill, access to that area would have had to remain to allow for periodic site inspections of the subway tunnel as is the case for the unfinished sections of the 2nd Avenue subway built in the 1970's. If not filled in, then as a result of required tunnel inspections, emergency telephones would have had to been installed just as they were installed in the 1970's built 2nd Avenue tunnel sections, and subject to routine inspections by NYCT telephone maintainers. |
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| (1130511) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by N6 Limited on Sun Jan 8 14:33:34 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by Handbrake on Fri Jan 6 23:02:20 2012. I agree |
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| (1130517) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 15:03:08 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by handbrake on Sun Jan 8 14:17:16 2012. yes its new haven RR.yes it was built at 76st.the tunnels extend from beyound the curtain wall at elderts lane to 79st&pitkin ave.the wall was put up sometime after 1956 as was reported here by other posters.it was not filled in.as far as inspections go,who does the inspections on the polo grounds shuttle,the irt ext.beyound flatbush& nostrand, the narrows tunnel at 65st.& the belt p`way.this has been kicked around for years& no one could come up with an answer.none of these tunnels have been filled in or are inspected.if they are,please show me the proof.also the 66th.ave ind.ext.that goes for over a train length towards the lirr hasn`t been filled in,who inspects it.I never said 76st.saw service.I,ve always posted that it was an empty tunnel from pitkin& elderts lane,as described to me by 2 different sources.why track was layed from pitkin yard to 76st.I can`t answer.also besides being on the model board at euclid ave its on the model board in pitkin yard.A piece of plastic now covers over it.this was done apx 10 years ago so as not to confuse the tower operaters as to where tracks A7 A8 were in operation or not. |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (1130521) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Jan 8 15:25:30 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Jan 8 11:43:36 2012. I would think that if construction continued east from Rocky Av which opened in 1936, that the subway would have been opened at least as far as ENY by 1942 if the final routing had been decided on especially considering that the entire IRT from City Hall to 145/Bway got completed in 4 years. |
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| (1130522) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Jan 8 15:27:45 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 09:04:04 2012. True but that would only have been if the entire Fulton St el could have been upgraded end to end which it was not. |
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| (1130523) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by mike cruz on Sun Jan 8 15:35:28 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 15:03:08 2012. I remember watching a news segment on the inspections of the 2nd ave segments years ago before the project was restarted and one section only had 1 way in and that was a small hatch in the sidewalk. The hatch didn't even look TA style soo who's to say there isn't a manhole on Pitkin ave that's being used as inspection access to the tunnel. Now this is a what iff, before anyone starts challenging me (cept you few) I'm just saying MAYBE. |
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| (1130524) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Jan 8 15:45:42 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 10:59:20 2012. Type 1 roadbed is conventional railroad type with full length crossties in ballasted roadbed. Type 2 consists of shoer ties imbedded in concrete with a trough between the running rails. Type 2 was first used only in stations of dual contract lines and the short ties were bolted down to the concrete for added strength. Later subway construction including the Montague St tunnel and the portion of the 14 St Line between Montrose and the portal N/O Bway Jct as well as the entire IND are entirely of type 2 however without the bolts through the ties since at some point it was decided that the bolts were not needed and the concrete was sufficient enough to secure the ties. More recent installations of type 2 are "modified" type 2 which has every 5th tie, the 3rd rail tie completely across from running rail to running rail. This type of modified type 2 was also used on portions of the IND on sharper curves to stabilize the ties at those locations. Initially, type 1 was used on special work (switches) but on many recent switch replacements, a sort of type 2 concrete roadbed with all ties across has been installed. Certain parts of the system like the 6 Av express tracks had type 8 which is all concrete with a trough between the running rails and rails on rubber pads installed as new construction. The 4 Av BMT express tracks in Bkln had type 8 installed but for some reason type 8 hasn't proven to be successful on the NYCTS and AFAIK all installations of it have been removed and replaced by modified type 2. There is a new type of roadbed which seems to be all concrete with ties molded into it which was installed on the Archer Av Line in Qns and the new South Ferry station but I have no idea of its actual construction or what it is called. I have noticed that on newer installations of both modified and regular type 2, the ties have short pieces of rebar through them to help stabilize them once the concrete is poured. |
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| (1130526) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 15:53:21 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by mike cruz on Sun Jan 8 15:35:28 2012. I,ll agree on that.on 66th ave west of the ind.there is a nondescript manhole which leads to the tunnel.this was descovered by the fire dept.in the early `60`s when they had a report of smoke coming out of a manhole cover.when they popped the cover they found a rung ladder going down to a small concrete landing encased by a cinderblock "closet"a tight squeeze going down.smoke was coming from the seams of the wall.when they broke thru the fire erupted& was put out.the fdny found they were on a 2 track subway tunnel with track,3rd rail& signals.the fire was a paper fire started by spontaneous combustion.there were NO BOT markings on the manhole.also since we`re on the subject of inspections I,d like to know who inspects the bowery on the b`way line[J train]provisions were made for a 3rd ave BRT subway there.unknown if its a shell station or just an empty space.you can see the the provision from the downtown side in the roof.also brennan states this.there is no entrance from the sealed up downtown staircase&token booth area. |
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| (1130529) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Jan 8 16:03:28 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 15:03:08 2012. It's unfortunate that when I was the zone trainmaster at Euclid in 1983, I never checked Pitkin Yd's board for the tape although I knew about the existence of that portion of the line on Euclid's board. To those of you who doubt the existence of the station shell, several people I knew but who didn't know each other all described the 76 St station shell in exactly the same way, a finished S/B (Queens bound) platform but an unfinished N/B (Manhattan bound) platform. If these people knew each other, than it would be very easy to get together and compare stories but what are the odds of several people who didn't know each other being able to fabricate the exact same description? One of my sources had indicated that the S/B lcl track did go into the station area and the unusual configuration of the bulkhead wall at the present end of track which causes the S/B lcl track to be about 50 ft shorter than the other 3 tracks does raise questions about that. Another poster asked about the width of the subway infrastructure in that area and although I haven't been down there in a while, I believe the subway infrastructure retains its 6 track width all the way down since it had to retain a 6 track width to allow for the A5 and A6 yd leads as well as the K1 and K2 ramps into Grant. While the A5 and A6 leads descend under the Pitkin Av mainline, A7 And A8 would ascend OVER the Pitkin Av mainline to reach the yard so the resulting infrastructure in that area is 2 levels down to allow room for A7 and A8 to pass above. |
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| (1130530) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Jan 8 16:16:23 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by randyo on Sun Jan 8 16:03:28 2012. By knowing a third party. |
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| (1130543) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by mike cruz on Sun Jan 8 16:35:35 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 15:53:21 2012. So where exactly was the fire crew? What line or area would it be today? |
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| (1130546) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by N6 Limited on Sun Jan 8 16:44:57 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by randyo on Sun Jan 8 16:03:28 2012. Are we sure that 76th street was under Pitkin Ave, and not Sutter Ave?View Larger Map |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 17:12:14 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Jan 8 16:16:23 2012. name the 3rd party. |
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| (1130553) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 17:13:38 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by mike cruz on Sun Jan 8 16:35:35 2012. the firemen were stationed on queens blvd,thats all I know. |
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| (1130554) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 17:14:18 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by N6 Limited on Sun Jan 8 16:44:57 2012. POSITIVE. |
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| (1130689) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by Dupont Circle Station on Sun Jan 8 23:06:53 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 15:53:21 2012. Did you ever get to checkout the mystery tunnel segment that was "discovered" in the early '60s under 108 St between Jewel Av and 71st Av when they were excavating for the apartment buildings at 70th Rd? |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by Dupont Circle Station on Sun Jan 8 23:30:42 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by Handbrake on Fri Jan 6 20:18:43 2012. 76th Street most certainly exists! Just not where The True |
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| (1130715) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by N6 Limited on Mon Jan 9 01:04:08 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Sun Jan 8 17:14:18 2012. I thought I was on to something with those sidewalk grates ;) |
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| (1130717) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 01:15:28 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by Dupont Circle Station on Sun Jan 8 23:30:42 2012. I can attest to that because I live there! |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 01:16:46 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by N6 Limited on Mon Jan 9 01:04:08 2012. The subway grates in the vicinity of Sutter Av are for the A7 and A8 yard leads. |
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| (1130782) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 10:12:39 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Sun Jan 8 23:06:53 2012. never even heard of it,post more info. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 10:33:16 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by mike cruz on Sun Jan 8 16:35:35 2012. the area would be rego park& its the queens blvd ind. local track. |
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| (1130789) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by mike cruz on Mon Jan 9 10:56:08 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 10:12:39 2012. same here. |
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| (1130888) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Jan 9 15:45:49 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Sun Jan 8 23:06:53 2012. never heard of that either...more detail,please. |
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| (1130895) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 16:16:49 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 10:12:39 2012. An oldtimer at Cord Meyer told me back in the 1980s that when they were excavating for the Continental and the one diagonally across 108th in 1960 they broke through into a tunnel. It was definitely IND construction going by the tunnel walls, catwalks and supporting columns. Had 2 trackways but no sign that rails or signals had ever been installed. There was wall lighting installed but not operating. The roadbed sloped down in the direction of the mainline and they estimated it would have gone under the mainline tracks. No way to tell if it would have followed the mainline or crossed and continued down Continental...it ended abruptly in bare concrete in the intersection of 108th & 71st.TA could only find a water-damaged inspection report from 1942 that listed it as a "utility corridor" but the rest of the records were beyond recognition. The city's land records showed there was a tunnel there, but not of the extent it was (they hit it when they were making new cuts into the street for service line connections). The city, ConEd and NYTel came along within a few months to fill it with a sewer line and all sorts of cabling. The excess space was filled in. There was no mistaking it as being anything but subway tunnel, almost certainly constructed along with the QB mainline. (No way was it merely a "utility corridor" as it was clearly a sibling of the 2-track IND segments.) Why it was there no one could figure out since there never was any official plan for a subway in 108th Street. Some of the speculation was it could have been used for construction equipment or layup tracks they changed their minds about (though that didn't make sense to me because the orientation would be to/from Jamaica or crossing QB, not trains from Manhattan terminating at Continental). Another rumor was it was for a spur off the Astoria/Horace Harding line. IAE it was gone and pretty much forgotten about by 1962. We'll probably never know why it was built. However, the inattention to preserving documentation at the TA and BoT apparently was SOP. I certainly won't say that the city not being able to explain why that 2 block stretch of tunnel was there and apparently forgotten about for almost 20 years, is any kind of proof that Pitkin was actually built to 76th Street. However, knowing how records weren't always given the TLC they need, it is possible the files are incomplete and speculation will run rampant about 76th Street until either the missing paperwork is found, or someone actually digs into Pitkin & 76th and does or does not find a station shell there (and posts clear photographic proof of whatever they find). While I think it's intriguing and that it would be neat to find The Lost Station, I am sick and tired of hearing the same anecdotal stories about it existing with no *hard* evidence to back it up. I can't believe that not one person here knows someone who works for the city or a utility with lines in that area they cannot prevail upon to give us some photos or reflective mapping of what's under that street. Or, for one of the badass urban explorers just take it upon themselves to somehow get under there themselves. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Jan 9 16:29:54 2012, in response to Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by kawasakir142 on Thu Jan 5 16:46:07 2012. 
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 16:56:02 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 16:16:49 2012. Tunnelrat: I would have thought that you of all people would have heard about this gem. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 17:19:56 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 16:56:02 2012. tunnelrat don`t be hearin`everytghing& definetly don`t be knowin` everything~ |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 17:36:24 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 16:16:49 2012. questions:what is cord meyer? ,what is LAE,.4th paragraph |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 17:45:34 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 17:36:24 2012. Cord Meyer is the company that developed a good chunk of Forest Hills. Owns lots of real estate there.IAE: In any event. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Jan 9 17:46:58 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by Elkeeper on Sat Jan 7 16:16:15 2012. not so...the IND had a nasty habit of destroying whole blocks to make a new thoroughfare,as was done with the Crosstown route from Flushing ave to Broadway[the New Union st]..the 6th ave extension..and planned South 4th to Beaver then Bushwick for the Utica subway..The Utica line would have continued Stuyvesant ave across Fulton st to Atlantic ave,cutting across the block at an angle,continuing As Utica avenue southeast. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 17:47:09 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 17:45:34 2012. thanks |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Jan 9 17:48:10 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by Handbrake on Fri Jan 6 20:43:47 2012. correct.. |
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| (1130932) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 17:53:25 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 10:12:39 2012. question,what is TLC. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 18:01:02 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by Edwards! on Mon Jan 9 17:46:58 2012. That was something I had pointed out in another thread on 76 St. It seems that Pitkin Av originally ended at Ruby St (I believe today's 75 St) and South picked up and continued east at a slight southeast angle away from the straight path of Pitkin. At some point, Pitkin Av was through routed to connect with South Rd and the new thoroughfare was named Pitkin Ave which is why if you look at a map of the area. Pitkin appears to bear slightly to the right at around 80 St or so if you are walking or driving east along Pitkin. There is a short section of South Rd that still exists between about 75 St and 80 St so it could be possible that the city through routed Pitkin at the same time and along with the construction of the 76 St station. That could also account for the lack of reliable records about the construction of 76 St station since it might have been piggybacked with other construction in the area and as was the case with 174 St Yd even been built by another city department totally unrelated to the B of T. I actually don't think Stuyvesant Av itself would have been continued across Fulton to Utica since the presence of the upper level station shell as is seems to indicate that such a through routing would probably not have been necessary. |
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| (1130938) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 18:01:54 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 16:16:49 2012. coupla more questions:i,m right in assuming the tunnel was built under 108st? why the hell didn`t you post this years ago?how long was the tunnel? |
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| (1130939) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 18:01:54 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 16:16:49 2012. coupla more questions:i,m right in assuming the tunnel was built under 108st? why the hell didn`t you post this years ago?how long was the tunnel? |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 18:09:10 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 18:01:02 2012. same thing with the 4th ave subway in bklyn,the city asked Con ed to build caverns along side it so that it is actually a 4track subway,I,ve heard several stories about the t.a.breaking thru the safety niches to do some type of maintainance,the latest was last year when I was in the tower talking to the guy in charge.he said a work crew had broken thru one of the niches& were amazed to find a 2 track empty subway tunnel. |
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| (1130951) | |
Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 18:33:35 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 16:16:49 2012. recheck your post of sunday.you say it was discovered in the 1960`s here you say the 1980`s typo? please claify. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Jan 9 18:35:46 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 18:01:02 2012. As the station shell is only 300 ft across..its southern end rest at the foot of Boys High School.The DOT actually did some similar to the area during the early 70's in any regard..redirecting the streets to its present configurations..an new street through there wouldn't have changed much in a way of what was there..only redirected traffic directly to/from Utica avenue to Fulton st further west,and created a through southern routing for Stuyvesant[one way]/Utica[two way].. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 18:39:54 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 18:09:10 2012. That is actually documented in the Book "New Subways for New York" which unfortunately is out of print. I live right along the 4 Av Subway in Bay Ridge and I would like to get in there some time just to check it out. My understanding is that those tunnel sections are not continuous but their existence was designed to facilitate the construction of the 2 additional tracks should it be required at some point. Although they are difficult to see through the skewed "RFW" on the r-46s, along the east wall of the 4 Av subway, there are safety niches that have been bricked shut all the way up from 86 St to just S/O 59 St where the subway widens to 4 tracks. Before the new tiles were installed in 86 St station, those bricked up safety niches could be seen from the N/B side of the station platform in the station area itself. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 18:46:00 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by Edwards! on Mon Jan 9 18:35:46 2012. Utica was through routed with Reid Av (Malcolm X Blvd) likely to facilitate operation of the Utica/Reid bus route. If Stuyvesant had been through routed for the subway, the area would probably have looked very interesting since both Stuyvesant and Reid mightha've been through routed also making a 3 way intersection and a small triangular park. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Jan 9 18:46:46 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 18:46:00 2012. Exactly.. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 18:47:21 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 18:39:54 2012. now why would they brick up safety niches unless they wanted to keep the homeless out. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Jan 9 18:51:26 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon), posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 18:47:21 2012. Those safety niches were bricked up back in 1967 and more than likely were that way when the subway was built probably to keep the Con Ed circuit breaker chambers and the subway infrastructure itself separate. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 19:02:15 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 17:53:25 2012. forget last post,i,m doing so much readin`-n-writin`that sometimes I miss the obvious. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by mike cruz on Mon Jan 9 19:04:05 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 17:19:56 2012. Damn I was all set to make a room with your pictures and some candles HAHAHA! |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by handbrake on Mon Jan 9 19:05:17 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon Jan 9 16:16:49 2012. Interesting bit of information. From what I know of NYCT, and even less of the BoT, record keeping may not be their best of best business practice.Considering how much information of the construction of the IND went into the trash heap, I can only imagine how much information was lost when both the IRT & BMT properties were absorbed by the City of New York into the BoT, and latter into NYCTA. With regards to 76th street, I doubt that there is a cover exists as is written on the Internet. I suspect that work could have been done, plans changed between the BoT organization and the then new NYCT organization in the early 50's. Not to mention the reams of paper records that characterize any large organization, especially a quasi government agency. What's needed is hard detective work, and eye witnesses that can still fog a mirror under their nose. Short of an actual site inspection (This would amount to trespassing for the great majority of readers on this board), to physical proof such as untouched photographs to prove or disprove all theories. There are quite a few hidden gems lying underground that I am certain are long forgotten. |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 19:06:37 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by mike cruz on Mon Jan 9 19:04:05 2012. SANTERIA? did i spel it rite? |
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Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon Jan 9 19:06:37 2012, in response to Re: Abandoned Utica Ave Upper Level (Pix Coming Soon) & 76th Street Saga, posted by mike cruz on Mon Jan 9 19:04:05 2012. SANTERIA? did i spel it rite? |
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