|
|
| Re: Last run of the R30 (1226807) | |
 |
|
| Home > SubChat | |
[ Post a New Response | Return to the Index ]
|
Page 4 of 6 |
||
|
| (1227478) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 14:47:10 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by NorthShore on Fri Jun 7 09:37:46 2013. No, the R16's merely closed a long term car shortage on the BMT that saw R1's being used on the 4th Ave local as far back as 1940. These cars eventually went back to the IND to cover for the new Rockaway service. |
|
|
| (1227480) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 14:50:36 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Fri Jun 7 14:33:28 2013. I seem to recall that some of the R-27/30s had side signs that read "L/14 St Exp" and "LL/14 St Lcl" instead of the more generic "14 St Line." As for the TT signs on Bway, pre Chrystie, there were 3 West End trains that put in N/B from City Hall Yd M - F and ran lcl from Canal to Astoria where they entered S/B West End Exp service. These trains carried the "TT/West End Lcl" signs which were appropriately changed at Astoria. Also, when I was working platform at Broad St sometime in late 1966/early 1967, a Jamaica train went bad in ENY Yd and it so happened that CIY had an extra train of R-32s available so it ran light from CIYd to Broad for Jamaica service. Unfortunately, the crews were not too knowledgeable about the signage and signed the train up "QB/Broadway Exp" instead of "J/Nassau St Exp." The AM Nassau St Bankers' Specials were able to both carry "M" since until they actually reached Nassau St, they never stopped at the same platforms Manhattan bound. In the PM, while the Brighton Nassau specials continued to carry "M" signs, the 4 Av Nassau specials carried "S/Special" signs since unlike their AM counterparts, they ran local S/B to 95 St. |
|
|
| (1227482) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 14:52:45 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by John from Glendale on Fri Jun 7 11:00:06 2013. I was once looking out the RWF of one on an M train and hearing the motorman curse every time he throttled up and the damned thing bucked and rocked before slowly beginning to accelerate. When we got to Pacific St and came in on the local track, he was radioed to go local to 36th St to (probably to cover for a late R) and he let loose on Koch, Cuomo and whoever was running the MTA at the time all the way to 9th St. The door was closed and I don't think he saw me there. |
|
|
(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
|
| (1227483) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 14:53:29 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by renee gil on Fri Jun 7 10:37:34 2013. I doubt that this is CIY due to the lack of 3rd rail. It looks more like LInden Yd which would be close to the area adjacent to the 14 St Line where the R-16s were scrapped. |
|
|
| (1227485) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 14:57:26 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jun 7 11:10:02 2013. No. That feature lasted until the R-22s although while the GE R-16s through 21s emitted a high pitched whine, the R-22s emitted a sort of low pitched hum sort of like a propeller airplane. |
|
|
| (1227486) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 15:04:15 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Flxible Metro on Fri Jun 7 12:04:29 2013. Actually, it was the assignment of the R-16s to the Jamaica Line that was one of the reasons that the Multis were pulled off the 14 St Line and assigned to Myrtle/Chambers. After the iND took over the outer portion of the Fulton St El, the Multis were no longer needed for the 14 St/Fulton service, so in order to keep up with the faster accelerating R-16s, the Multis were assigned to Myrtle/Chambers which at the time ran all day Mon - Sat as locals during the midday. |
|
|
| (1227487) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 15:06:04 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by renee gil on Fri Jun 7 01:35:30 2013. Yeah, the autumn of 1987 was a good time for oddball assignments. R46's on the Astoria N, R30's on the Forest Hills R, R10's on the K, that R68 on the F. So many cars were out for GOH that gaps needed to be closed with whatever was available. |
|
|
| (1227493) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 15:21:39 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 14:35:54 2013. It's clear that in 1960 they had no idea what services they were going to run post-Chrystie. |
|
|
| (1227500) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 15:36:13 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 15:21:39 2013. Somewhere on line, I came across some early plans for a post Chrystie service plan which I believe does go back that far. |
|
|
| (1227501) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 15:37:55 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 14:35:54 2013. The proposed B service was a last minute revision..the West End line was suppose to be linked with the Queens Blvd Local via 60th st and Broadway local..Q to Astoria via the Broadway Exp..with the J operating along 4th avenue to 95th st at all times."BT" would have continued into Brooklyn to the WEST END line from midtown..while KK from Broadway/Jamaica would take over BB upper Manhattan branch to 168th st. obviously..some of this was too damn much..especially since it seemed to be an all out attempt to get rid of the RR..so..the routes were adjusted to what we got in 1967..mostly. |
|
|
| (1227502) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 15:44:10 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 15:36:13 2013. Nothing concrete enough to put on signage. |
|
|
| (1227503) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 15:44:10 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 15:36:13 2013. Nothing concrete enough to put on signage. |
|
|
| (1227505) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 7 15:48:42 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 15:44:10 2013. They were digging the Essex Street connection or at least letting out contracts, when the R30's were under construction.I think the sign shop was more interested in obliterating BMT route numbers with a vengeance than they were being proactive for Chrystie. However, there was no sign of the letter J thru M until Nov 1967 on the maps. The Eastern routes simply had no designation. |
|
|
| (1227506) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 7 15:52:31 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 15:37:55 2013. Why would they call a West-End Forest Hills service via Bway "B", rather than just "T" ? |
|
|
| (1227508) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jun 7 16:17:41 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 14:52:45 2013. "Happy motoring" was a way of life back then. :( |
|
|
| (1227509) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jun 7 16:18:39 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Fri Jun 7 14:57:26 2013. Wow ... I remember the sound, never associated it. |
|
|
| (1227513) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 16:45:07 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 7 15:52:31 2013. there was no B..The Bway service would have kept the T signal..while the 6th ave version would have used BT signs. |
|
|
| (1227514) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 16:51:52 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 7 15:48:42 2013. Chrystie st was started in the late 50's. |
|
|
| (1227515) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 16:54:14 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 7 15:48:42 2013. Chrystie st was started in the late 50's.The east had numbers signs on the trains[R16 and Multi cars]..and maps. |
|
|
| (1227517) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 7 16:59:54 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 16:54:14 2013. My TA-issued map, which I still, have have no numbers for those routes. |
|
|
| (1227521) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 17:06:14 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 15:44:10 2013. yes there was..nothing much changed[for the east] with Chrystie st,except for the 15 being through routed with the QT to Brighton. the 15 local still ran as the JJ evenings and weekends..and as the 14 local during rush hours. the Bankers specials became the RJ from 95th to Jamaica. But before that..there were 3 services on the Broadway Brooklyn El. 15 local and express=QJ/J 14 rush hour local=JJ/KK/K 10 rush hour express=M |
|
|
| (1227522) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 17:10:49 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 14:52:45 2013. the 16 were known to rock left right left right badly. the sway was so bad on one train i rode..i had to get off. |
|
|
| (1227524) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Lou From Middletown NY on Fri Jun 7 17:15:00 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jun 7 14:29:29 2013. Actually, the story of the Datsun/Nissan name changes is very long and convoluted. It involves everything from The War, down to corporate politics.My mom has a 98 Honda Civic that is in great shape - as does my sister. Hers has lasted 15 years in car killing Rochester! Both of those were assembled in Tennessee. My sister an her husband also have a Honda Hybrid My current vehicle is a 2006 Mitsubishi (now THERES a name for WWII veterans!) with over 100,000 on it - and it runs like a top! That was made in Illinois, with more 'domestic content' than a lot of so-called 'American' cars. |
|
|
| (1227529) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jun 7 17:36:48 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Lou From Middletown NY on Fri Jun 7 17:15:00 2013. All Hondas here too, including a Hybrid. Quite happy with them. We had a K-car back in the 80's that was Mitsubishi inside ... awful car. Almost as bad as a Subaru. Now THAT was a piece of crap. |
|
|
| (1227532) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 17:52:50 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 17:10:49 2013. I used to think that was normal when I was a little kid. |
|
|
| (1227533) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 17:53:53 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 16:54:14 2013. Did they get full numbered rollsigns, or just for ED (10-16)? |
|
|
| (1227535) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 18:01:33 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Edwards! on Fri Jun 7 15:37:55 2013. Some of these ideas were just horrible. Replacing the R with the J was an insult. As it was, the adopted service pattern was an insult to Brighton riders. The QB should have been made the all-day Brighton local and the M should have been diverted down to Ditmas Ave. No QJ. |
|
|
| (1227546) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jun 7 18:46:30 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 7 13:59:38 2013. we are not talking cosmetics here. Half of the R-16 fleet was designed so that the motor generator cooled the main motor grids. If the motor generator failed, the car burned. The entire propulsion system needed replacement @ roughly $50,000 per car plus another $8k - $10K for a converter to replace the motor generator and about the same for a reliable compressor to replace the old belt driven 2CY. So after nearly investing $70,000 plus labor,(into a car that cost less than $122,000) you still would have had a non-air conditioned vehicle with protruding door operator swing panels and a carbon steel body that had already seen 2/3 of it's usable life. Probably not the best investment. |
|
|
| (1227569) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 19:41:02 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Train Dude on Fri Jun 7 18:46:30 2013. They spent nearly 100K rehabbing the WH R10's in 1985. At least the R16's didn't require conductors to perch like vultures at every stop. |
|
|
| (1227582) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 20:03:30 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Flxible Metro on Fri Jun 7 04:12:01 2013. I would give one of my lesser needed toes for one of those 1969ish R16 rollsigns. |
|
|
| (1227583) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 20:05:55 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Lou From Middletown NY on Fri Jun 7 14:08:13 2013. So it went BOOM instead of VROOM?Amirite? Is this thing on? |
|
|
| (1227635) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by renee gil on Sat Jun 8 00:42:27 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Fri Jun 7 10:18:08 2013. you're welcome |
|
|
| (1227640) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Jun 8 01:33:53 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by CJ on Fri Jun 7 10:35:29 2013. Clever graffiti. |
|
|
| (1227642) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Jun 8 01:46:23 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by SUBWAYMAN on Thu Jun 6 02:24:31 2013. The GE units were all retired in 1983. The WH units lingered on, in ever dwindling numbers into the spring of 1987. In their final months they generally clustered to the M line, though they occasionally ended up on the L, J, Broadway R and at least one set ran on the Astoria/Broadway B (yellow) in each direction during rish hour (I used to chase that train a lot, it kept a fairly common schedule). I really felt bad for M riders, and did not understand why they had to have virtually the entire remaining fleet assigned to it, instead of being spread around to the J and L. |
|
|
| (1227644) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by CJ on Sat Jun 8 02:12:15 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Jun 8 01:46:23 2013. It's kind of ironic isn't it? 26 years later the eastern division now runs mostly new trains and the R42s are the only old trains left. They use to get all the old stuff before. |
|
|
| (1227651) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 8 06:22:23 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 19:41:02 2013. What did they spend per car on the R30 GOH, which did not last very long ? |
|
|
| (1227667) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 8 08:50:11 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 20:03:30 2013. They had a variety of roll signs pre-Chrystie.Most had just routes 10, 13 thru 16, but I believe had the whole "B" division for destination signs. Others had to get "A" in 1954. Still more had to get "GG" for the R1 meltdown in 1965 or 66. I have seen books with the south sign "95th ST, Frt Hmlton" and the generic bold face "LOCAL" for the route sign. |
|
|
| (1227689) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Sat Jun 8 11:22:50 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jun 7 19:41:02 2013. That doesn't mean that it was a wise investment. They spent nearly double what a new R-46 cost to overhaul the old ones but that was 1/2 of what a new car cost at the time. They also got a car that was capable of a 100,000+ MDBF where the original one was under 20. |
|
|
| (1227695) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Jun 8 11:28:48 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Train Dude on Sat Jun 8 11:22:50 2013. They had to do something. In 1985 the full R68 order wouldn't be on the road for 4 years and they needed something to fill the gap that wasn't the decrepit shit the entire R10 fleet was in at the time. |
|
|
| (1227741) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by CJ on Sat Jun 8 14:04:44 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 8 06:22:23 2013. I think it was $2 million per eight car train. This is according to what I read on nycsubway.org. |
|
|
| (1227754) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Sat Jun 8 14:54:45 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by CJ on Sat Jun 8 02:12:15 2013. Actually, that's not quite the case. In the mid 1930s, the 14 St Line got the newest cars, the Multis for use principally on the new 14 St/Fulton service with the excess units operating to Canarsie along with a few trains of steels to make service. In 1954, the Jamaica Line received what were then the newest cars on the system, the R-16s. What held up any more new car assignments for the Eastern was the need to equip the Southern Div with new cars since the Eastern already had the last order of new cars. |
|
|
| (1227871) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Sun Jun 9 09:18:57 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Sat Jun 8 14:54:45 2013. Why weren't the R16's instead put on Broadway Express service ? |
|
|
| (1227934) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Sun Jun 9 16:48:35 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Joe V on Sun Jun 9 09:18:57 2013. Which Broadway are you referring to, Bway Manhattan or Bway Bkln? |
|
|
| (1227940) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Sun Jun 9 17:01:29 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Sun Jun 9 16:48:35 2013. Manhattan, like the Brighton, or Sea Beach express ? |
|
|
| (1227941) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 9 17:02:34 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Sun Jun 9 16:48:35 2013. Coulda been Broadway in Queens too, since the R16s ran on the Queens Boulevard line. |
|
|
| (1227945) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Sun Jun 9 17:04:38 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 9 17:02:34 2013. They never got to the Queen Blvd line until 1966 on temporary GG service. |
|
|
| (1227957) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Sun Jun 9 17:36:05 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Joe V on Sun Jun 9 17:01:29 2013. There was talk around 1960 of taking the R-16s off the Jamaica Line and putting them on the Brighton Line but the local rather than the express. I think the problem was that there weren't enough of them to equip nay of the Southern Div lines completely with them but there were enough cars to completely equip the Jamaica Line with a few left over to spread a few to some other Eastern Div lines. |
|
|
| (1227960) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Sun Jun 9 17:43:46 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Sun Jun 9 17:36:05 2013. 200 cars could not hold down the Sea Beach Express to 57th ? That was no longer a run that the pokey "15". Would have kept them out of the snow most of the way too.I think it may have been a lure to get Jamaica- lower Manhattan riders off the dingy Arnines on the crowded train. But they didn't make a dent. |
|
|
| (1227965) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Sun Jun 9 17:52:22 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by Joe V on Sun Jun 9 17:43:46 2013. Actually, the run on the Sea Beach during the winter would have place the R-16s in more snow than a run on the Jamaica Line. Also, the Jamaica Line at the time ran quite a few 6 car trains even in the rush so there might not have been enough cars to provide a complete rush hour service of 8 car consists. Ill check some of my historical stats and see what might have been required at the time. |
|
|
| (1227969) | |
Re: Last run of the R30 |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Sun Jun 9 17:57:37 2013, in response to Re: Last run of the R30, posted by randyo on Sun Jun 9 17:52:22 2013. Yeh, I think only a 60 -90 minute window had 8 car trains, so some consists never got 8 cars. I suppose that deficit permitted some R16's on the 14, and zero or 1 on the 10 and 14. |
|
|
|
Page 4 of 6 |
||
