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Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010  I was in midtown last week. I wasn't actually railfanning but I was hoping to catch one of the R44s running on the  since I had to ride it anyway.Mid-afternoon, I was at 23rd Street, adjusting the settings on my camera. (I bought it used; the auto white balance has always been a little wonky, so I have to make sure to set the white balance manually.) Just about then, I heard yelling from behind me. I turned around to see what the commotion was about and observed what appeared to be a security guard of some sort; the type that accompany the workers who open and service the metrocard vending machines -- who approached me and stated that "photography wasn't allowed." I informed him that there was no such prohibition. He became belligerent towards me, saying he was going to call the police, that they were going to lock me up, and he wanted me to remain there until the police came. I told him I had no intention of waiting. After letting an  train pass, the arrived— with R44s. I took a few pictures and got on. Before I did, the security person was talking with the booth clerk and apparently trying to call the cops.This security guard acted like a total idiot. Photography is legal— even photography of open vending machines; a picture I had no intention of taking until his rant inspired me. (I'd already paid the fare, and wasn't going to step out for such a pic, but I took a vague one through the bars, mostly of him.) I might consider sending a letter to the MTA and/or the security company that he works for. Thoughts? |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jul 23 15:36:35 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. I could be wrong but I think he works for NYCT. As such you should definitely send your complaint, with photos, to NYCT. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 15:49:45 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. Always you!!! Your last name isn't Mitty, is it? |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 15:49:45 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. Always you!!! Your last name isn't Mitty, is it? |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 15:52:43 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 15:49:45 2010. If you did nothing but ride subway trains and take pictures it would happen to you too. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 15:54:38 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 15:52:43 2010. I somehow doubt that. I actually do a lot of rail photography and rail video outside of the MTA. A little respect for other's rules goes a long way |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 23 15:59:05 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 15:52:43 2010. No, that never happens to me and I have no life. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 16:07:21 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 15:54:38 2010. I think that he does it so often plus he stands out for his appearance in a way that you wouldn't. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 16:08:22 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 23 15:59:05 2010. You don't photograph as much as he does and he also looks interesting. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by arnine on Fri Jul 23 16:25:51 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. Well this time I think you handled urself well. Yes, I would let the MTA know, and his employer but I thought those guards wear MTA patches never seen a private one accompany a tech but that isn't 2 say it doesn't happen |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 23 16:26:20 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 16:08:22 2010. You know what I look like? |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by arnine on Fri Jul 23 16:27:41 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 16:07:21 2010. I think you are right about it being his appearance. But, it is still wrong for them 2 single him out b/c of that.Although, whenever the PAPD cops see me with my big bag they almost always stop me to inspect my bag :( |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 16:31:27 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 16:08:22 2010. Looks interesting? How do you mean that? Not that there is anything wrong with that... :) |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 23 16:33:29 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 16:31:27 2010. I believe Nilet has that Ted Kaczynski look going on. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 16:49:29 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 23 16:26:20 2010. Yes. Your picture was posted today. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by checkthedoorlight on Fri Jul 23 18:33:32 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. Man, it's always you.....have you ever considered a new hobby? |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by PATHman on Fri Jul 23 18:34:59 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. The security guard was wrong. However, just to save yourself the headache you should've walked away and let it go. You could've gone to Spring Street. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Fri Jul 23 18:41:43 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by checkthedoorlight on Fri Jul 23 18:33:32 2010. That's cold... |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by MattW@15st_prospect_park on Fri Jul 23 18:52:35 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 23 16:33:29 2010. I thought he was Ted's son... |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jul 23 18:59:07 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. This always seems to happen to you. Sure that you're not the problem? |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jul 23 18:59:33 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by checkthedoorlight on Fri Jul 23 18:33:32 2010. It's not the hobby that's the problem. It's the way he handles it. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jul 23 18:59:52 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Osmosis Jones on Fri Jul 23 18:41:43 2010. How? |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Fri Jul 23 19:15:57 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jul 23 18:59:52 2010. My mistake, I meant to respond to the OP. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Jul 23 19:39:54 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. Well, those guards are actually MTA Collection Agents, similar to armored truck guards, employed by the MTA and handle all revenue collections from station booths and Metrocard vending machines.And yes, photography is very much legal, and to be honest you should have got a name and badge number (or employee number) and make a complaint. Or with the information you have (location, day, date, time, etc.) forward a complaint anyway, and give as much detailed info as possible. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 19:50:22 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by checkthedoorlight on Fri Jul 23 18:33:32 2010. I suspect that it's not the hobby. I think this young man would approach any similar situation in any hobby with the same seeming chip on his shoulder that keeps things contentious for him in railfanning. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 19:55:13 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. Since I wasn't there I can only speculate but there are legitimate security concerns related to the servicing of Metrocard Vending Machines. Photographing or videotaping might be a way of detecting soft spots in procedures that could later be studied and used for criminal purposes. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by HarryP on Fri Jul 23 20:02:52 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. Looks like this is becoming a trend! I had my encounter with a PAT Bully in Pittsburgh on July 2 of this year. This trend will continue as long as Homeland Security is instructing transit agencies and the general public to be on the alert for suspicious activity and to report same to the authorities. Apparently, many "patriotic citizens" are being whipped into a frenzy over the threat of terrorism and are taking matters into their own hands.No matter what good intentions these people have, it's no excuse for their conduct, and if they are employed by a transit agency, they should be reported before these encounters turn into potentially violent confrontations. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by R142 #6666 on Fri Jul 23 20:10:43 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. 
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by R30A on Fri Jul 23 20:13:22 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 23 16:26:20 2010. I know what both of you look like. You're a lot less suspicious looking Chris. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jul 23 20:14:49 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 19:55:13 2010. Since I wasn't there I can only speculate but there are legitimate security concerns related to the servicing of Metrocard Vending Machines. Photographing or videotaping might be a way of detecting soft spots in procedures that could later be studied and used for criminal purposes. No, that obviously can't be it since photography in public areas is 100% legal as long as no other legitimate rules or regulations are violated, and I know of no legitimate rules and regulations prohibiting photography of the servicing of MVMs. Furthermore he stated that he was not photographing the servicing of the MVMs until AFTER he was yelled at. In fact, it seems he wasn't taking any photographs at all before he was yelled at. Finally, he wasn't told that he couldn't photograph the servicing of MVMs, he was told that he couldn't photograph at all. I'm quite surprised that as an employee of NYCT and as an active member of this forum, you would make such incredibly shortsighted speculation. As you should know, if the security guard actually thought he was observing suspicious activity, he should have called the police or a superior (or possibly, if allowed, properly investigated the situation). And if he thought he was observing prohibited or illegal activity, he should have taken what physical action he has under his authority to apprehend the perpetrator. Take Pride,
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 20:21:34 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jul 23 20:14:49 2010. Since you choose to believe Nilet's version of the story without question, there seems to be nothing further to discuss. You are entitled to your opinion.Time 20:21 |
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SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 20:29:00 2010, in response to Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 15:32:25 2010. I normally don't post about anti-photography nuts on SubChat because many SubChatters just aren't mature enough to handle such posts. I made one exception in this case to help demonstrate why I have such a policy.Take, for example, Chris R16/R2730, one of the repeat offenders. In response to my post, he implied that it was my fault; I look wrong and it never happens to him, so it must be me that's responsible. In response to a post by Harry P, however, he placed the blame squarely on the responsible party, namely the employee who insisted that photography was somehow illegal. The responses to Harry P's post were all along a similar vein; expressing support, and noting that the employee was in the wrong. The responses to my post, largely from Chris, Olog, and Train Dude, ranged from calling me responsible, insisting I'd made it up, to suggesting that photography is actually illegal in all or part of NYCT. Olog and Train Dude both insisted that I caused the incident, that I broke the rules, that I did something wrong. They didn't say the same things in response to Harry's post. Except my post is Harry's post. Literally. Copied and pasted. Only the job titles and locations were changed. Security guard for maintenance worker, C train for 52 trolley, 23rd Street for South Hills Junction, afternoon for morning. Otherwise, it is the exact same post. As this demonstrates, people such as Chris, Olog, and Train Dude don't actually read posts, let alone put any thought into the words they type in response. They read only the title, see that my name is at the top, and respond with mindless drivel spewed out of arbitrary assumptions and ingrained double standards. Even internal consistency is thrown aside as these individuals leap to pursue a mindless vendetta against some random guy on the internet that none of them have ever actually met, shrieking mindless insults in the process. I can only hope that this behaviour ceases once the aforementioned individuals have received psychiatric treatment. This is why I don't normally mention such incidents in this particular forum. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 20:31:36 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by PATHman on Fri Jul 23 18:34:59 2010. I couldn't go to Spring Street; I wasn't actually "out railfanning." I had to get uptown; taking the (C) train was the way I needed to go, but I didn't have time to go downtown first. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 20:31:58 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 16:49:29 2010. Where? |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 20:35:11 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 20:31:58 2010. Somewhere in the mosque thread IIRC. |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 20:45:39 2010, in response to SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 20:29:00 2010. First of all, Harry's post was by no means your post except in your mind, perhaps. Harry may disagree with the behavior but he understands where it stems from. That is not to say that I agree with Harry either.What I object to is you. I don't know about what you look like although since so many people make an issue out of it I'd wonder what part that plays in your daily trials and tribulations. Keep in mind what Albert Einstein said: Then there is my philosophy; |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 23 20:47:43 2010, in response to SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 20:29:00 2010. Take, for example, Chris R16/R2730, one of the repeat offenders.In response to my post, he implied that it was my fault; I look wrong and it never happens to him, so it must be me that's responsible. In response to a post by Harry P, however, he placed the blame squarely on the responsible party, namely the employee who insisted that photography was somehow illegal. The responses to Harry P's post were all along a similar vein; expressing support, and noting that the employee was in the wrong. Oh for the love of God, get over yourself! I, and the others, were joking. We do note that you seem to be harassed more than most, which leads many to believe you might be doing something different which provokes a reaction. I am a uniform supporter of photographers' rights. You, HarryP, Terrapin, if you're not breaking any rules, I am on your side. Take two and come back in the morning. 
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by checkthedoorlight on Fri Jul 23 21:23:27 2010, in response to SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 20:29:00 2010. It *IS* your fault. You always insist on arguing with anyone who tries to enforce a no-photography law, rather than apologizing and moving on. Whether or not they are right, nobody is going to listen to you spouting off regulation codes to their face. THAT is the reason why you always end up in handcuffs or having to run away. I've been stopped for photography issues 3 times - twice by cops, and once by a T/O. All three times I walked away with no harm done, nothing confiscated or erased, and not having to worry about being followed, because I didn't try to create a confrontation. It's not worth the hassle, seriously. |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 21:28:57 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jul 23 20:14:49 2010. "I'm quite surprised that as an employee of NYCT and as an active member of this forum, you would make such incredibly shortsighted speculation."I'm quite suprised that after all these years and as an active member of this forum, that you still cannot accept the fact that when I'm here I am only a member of this forum and do not speak for my employer. You might want to ask yourself why you can't grasp that concept. BTW: I met another former friend of your yesterday. Another interesting discussion for another time.... |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jul 23 21:31:45 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 20:45:39 2010. His new post in this subthread reminds me of people on the show "Cops" professing their innocence as they're being hauled away in cuffs. Don't know why, but it's so similar . . . |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 21:35:07 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jul 23 21:31:45 2010. He refuses to accept responsibility for his behavior and feeds off others like weinberg who tell him - "Go on - we got your back!" and let him fight for the ones wh are afraid to. He's just their tool |
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Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street |
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Posted by HarryP on Fri Jul 23 21:39:46 2010, in response to Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street, posted by Easy on Fri Jul 23 20:35:11 2010. No one has the legal authority to detain or attempt to detain any person, unless he is a duly sworn Peace Officer or Police Officer.I will admit that one's appearance and demeanor could be contributing factors in photograpy encounters. The bottom line is: engaging in lawful activities, one should not have to be bothered or harassed -- that's what the founding fathers of our country wanted when the Constitution was drawn. That's what made America stand out from the rest of the world, and what some short-sighted beaurocrats seem hell-bent on destroying in the name of maintaining order. |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 21:45:51 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 20:45:39 2010. Keep in mind what Albert Einstein said:"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." Just so you are aware, Einstein didn't say that, it's not actually true, and your implied premise that I am engaging in the activity you deride is false. Then there is my philosophy; "If one person calls you a jackass, you ignore them but when everyone does, start looking for a straw hat with cutouts for your ears and get used to wearing a saddle." It seems you're the only one calling me as such. Chris recanted everything as soon as he got busted, and Olog isn't actually human so he doesn't count. |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jul 23 21:47:49 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 21:45:51 2010. Olog didn't call you any names, so don't try to claim he did in a sideways manner.Besides, the original title of the thread misled me into thinking that you found romance with a security guard. |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 21:52:13 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by checkthedoorlight on Fri Jul 23 21:23:27 2010. It's illegal to post the word "is" in capital letters with asterisks for emphasis. Leave SubChat immediately and never post here again!If I were to have you arrested for posting in this fashion, then it would be your fault, by your own argument. Maybe someday, you'll understand the concept of "rule of law" and see exactly why your post is so ridiculous. |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jul 23 21:53:45 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 21:52:13 2010. Still can't face the truth, eh. |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 21:57:37 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jul 23 21:47:49 2010. You confessed that you are unfit for civilisation previously.However, I do apologise for drawing undue attention to your simian heritage. In the future, I will remember to refer to you only as "psychotic," "sociopathic," a "toddler," or some combination thereof. |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 22:02:35 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 21:45:51 2010. If you believe wikapedia. Then again there are other sources that would contradict that |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Nilet on Fri Jul 23 22:03:21 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 23 20:47:43 2010. Heh, you're just like the would-be mugger who threatened me with a (nonexistent) gun, ordered me to turn over my wallet, and then insisted the whole thing was just a joke after I had him arrested.Of course, OIog, Train Dude, and almost certainly yourself will soon be posting furious responses about how the whole incident was my fault for refusing to give him my wallet and then apologise and walk away. |
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Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street) |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Fri Jul 23 22:04:04 2010, in response to Re: SubChat Exposé (Re: Encounter With Security Guard At 23rd Street), posted by Train Dude on Fri Jul 23 20:45:39 2010. Then there is my philosophy;"If one person calls you a jackass, you ignore them but when everyone does, start looking for a straw hat with cutouts for your ears and get used to wearing a saddle." Eh? Say What?   |
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