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| Re: New York is doomed - more proof (173358) | |
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Re: New York is doomed - more proof |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Dec 7 00:23:05 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Market-Frankford on Wed Dec 6 23:42:46 2006. Who in their right mind would come to New York because of Central Park?You ever been to Central Park? If not, then that comment is moot and out of ignorance. Would you recommend Riverside Park instead, is that what you're saying . . . ? |
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Posted by American Pig on Thu Dec 7 05:58:10 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Market-Frankford on Wed Dec 6 23:38:04 2006. False. |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Thu Dec 7 07:08:44 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by American Pig on Thu Dec 7 05:58:10 2006. I never understood why people think New Yorkers are rude until I saw Penn Station in the PM rush.Only one problem: those aren't New Yorkers. |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Dec 7 14:15:04 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Dec 7 07:08:44 2006. Only one problem: those aren't New YorkersLong Oylanders aren't New Yawkers? |
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Posted by mambomta on Thu Dec 7 14:27:52 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Dec 7 14:15:04 2006. Long Oylanders aren't New Yawkers?Not in the context Market-Frankford is using. |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Thu Dec 7 17:02:53 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Dec 7 14:15:04 2006. No, they're not. They don't live in New York City. |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Thu Dec 7 17:03:33 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Dec 7 17:02:53 2006. No, they only sound like it. The real hoity-toity New Yorkers sound like they're from Kalifornia. |
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Posted by AlM on Thu Dec 7 21:00:42 2006, in response to New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Peter Rosa on Tue Dec 5 10:31:26 2006. Ground Zero is a hole in the ground with no hope that construction will begin anytime in the foreseeable futureConstruction has already begun. Take a trip down on the 1 when you have a chance. |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Thu Dec 7 21:17:49 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by AlM on Thu Dec 7 21:00:42 2006. Don't interrupt his fantasy! |
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Re: New York is doomed - more proof |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Thu Dec 7 21:18:12 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by RonInBayside on Thu Dec 7 21:17:49 2006. 8-) |
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Re: New York is doomed - more proof |
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Posted by Market-Frankford on Thu Dec 7 21:25:02 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Olog-hai on Thu Dec 7 00:23:05 2006. Yes, I have beeen to CP and it's way overrated. |
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Posted by Market-Frankford on Thu Dec 7 21:51:26 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by American Pig on Thu Dec 7 05:58:10 2006. Are you kidding me? Everybody (except mabye NYers) knows that NYers are more hostile. It's like a fact of life. |
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Posted by mambomta on Thu Dec 7 21:53:13 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Market-Frankford on Thu Dec 7 21:51:26 2006. Are you kidding me? Everybody (except mabye NYers) knows that NYers are more hostile. It's like a fact of life.Only people who have no clue what they are talking about. People constantly say that they are pleasantly surprised that NYers are actually friendly and wonder why people think that we are hostile. |
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Posted by mambomta on Thu Dec 7 21:54:13 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Market-Frankford on Thu Dec 7 21:25:02 2006. Yes, I have beeen to CP and it's way overrated.It depends upon who you ask. Not everyone thinks the way you do. |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Thu Dec 7 22:24:34 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by mambomta on Thu Dec 7 21:53:13 2006. New Yorkers are the friendliest around. Not only that, but they know all about knishes and rye bread, which of which Kansas Citians have no clue. |
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Posted by Fred G on Fri Dec 8 09:44:40 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Market-Frankford on Thu Dec 7 21:51:26 2006. That's a myth. It's been my experience that NYers are quite friendly and not at all like the movies and TV show. Sure, there are rude people about, but that goes for anywhere you go. They similarly call us Noo Inglenders 'cold' or 'reserved' or even 'rude' but it's because we don't get in your face about your business, not because we're rude and callous.your pal, Fred |
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Posted by Charles G on Fri Dec 8 14:31:13 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by mambomta on Thu Dec 7 21:53:13 2006. The out-of-towners I know generally report that they find New Yorkers to be far more friendly than they expected -- once you engage them. If you don't go out of your way to engage them, most New Yorkers will pass you right by. In other parts of the country there are many friendly people who don't wait to be engaged. In New York, we call those people nuts. |
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Posted by BIE on Fri Dec 8 15:33:21 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Charles G on Fri Dec 8 14:31:13 2006. IAWTP |
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Posted by PATHman on Fri Dec 8 16:31:59 2006, in response to New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Peter Rosa on Tue Dec 5 10:31:26 2006. All it takes is one smartass politician (cough**Sheldon Silver**cough) to KO a project. Politicians seek to extort all potential developers. The thing I don't understand is that people know that NYC is a big city, yet they complain when the city tries to expand. If they wanted to live in a small town they should've live in Idaho. |
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New Yorker Question...was Re: New York is doomed - more proof |
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Posted by Zman179 on Fri Dec 8 17:46:42 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Market-Frankford on Thu Dec 7 21:51:26 2006. Here's a question (based on a true story.)You're a tourist in New York on the corner of 48th Street and Madison Avenue and you're not sure of your surroundings. You ask a pushcart vendor where Rockefeller Center is located. The vendor rudely says to you that because you're not buying anything, then he doesn't have any information to give you. You walk away from the cart in disbelief. Another New Yorker, who overheard your troubles, goes out of his way to approach you and tell you precisely (and in a kind manner) how to get exactly where you need to go. The question: if your opinion was based solely on this one incident, what would you think about New Yorkers? |
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Re: New Yorker Question...was Re: New York is doomed - more proof |
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Posted by American Pig on Fri Dec 8 17:53:05 2006, in response to New Yorker Question...was Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Zman179 on Fri Dec 8 17:46:42 2006. I would think that puschart vendors are assholes but that New Yorkers who work in other occupations generally aren't. |
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Posted by R4 Bryn Mawr LCL/R5 Paoli EXP on Fri Dec 8 20:27:39 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by BIE on Fri Dec 8 15:33:21 2006. 2x |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Dec 8 21:31:10 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by David of Broadway on Thu Dec 7 17:02:53 2006. No, they're not. They don't live in New York City.Last I checked, Brooklyn and Queens people live in New York City, and last I looked, they were also Long Oylanders. |
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Posted by American Pig on Sat Dec 9 03:08:57 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Dec 8 21:31:10 2006. Nobody takes the LIRR from Brooklyn to Penn. Maybe a railfan on a joyride, but that's it. |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Dec 9 07:18:14 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by American Pig on Sat Dec 9 03:08:57 2006. That's fine, but I was responding to the fact that someone said Long Islanders don't live in New York City....many of them do.And forgetting that, and if talking about "rude NYers at Penn" why did you just bring up Brooklyn in response to me saying that many Long Islanders live in NYC? There are many Queens LIRR riders riding out/into Penn. |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Dec 9 07:20:50 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Dec 6 13:00:18 2006. If ONLY we could get STEINGRABBER to move to Vermont. Heh.Hahaha...."The New York Yankees of Rutland"..... |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Dec 9 07:24:45 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Dec 9 07:20:50 2006. No no no no ... MANCHESTER! Mount Equinox! Let's see Steingrabber snatch a breath up THERE! :) |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Dec 9 07:27:00 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Dec 9 07:24:45 2006. Manchester! Sure, banish those Yankees to the land of Outlets! |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Dec 9 07:43:07 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Dec 9 07:27:00 2006. Now stop it! Consider that scenario once again. Does it NOT fit? Steingrabber could be shaking down TOURISTS instead of the municipality! And after all, it's that what PROPER politics is all about? Soak the RUBES, not us? :)After 12 years of PATURKEY, *WE* know the score! Heh. |
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Posted by BMTLines on Sat Dec 9 10:23:43 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by AlM on Thu Dec 7 21:00:42 2006. Construction has already begun.Yes but will it be completed before the year 2025? |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Dec 9 10:56:43 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by BMTLines on Sat Dec 9 10:23:43 2006. Haha. Yeah, right. |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Dec 9 10:58:48 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Dec 9 07:43:07 2006. Okay, sold. Rutland was a little bit too "real" for the Yankees anyway... |
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Posted by Market-Frankford on Sat Dec 9 17:19:55 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by American Pig on Sat Dec 9 03:08:57 2006. That may be true, but people certainly take the LIRR from Queens to Penn Station. |
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Posted by Market-Frankford on Sat Dec 9 17:26:57 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by RonInBayside on Tue Dec 5 13:36:40 2006. IMO blondes are UGLY (with a very small number of exceptions, and she's definetly not one of them). |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sat Dec 9 20:42:19 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by BIE on Tue Dec 5 17:44:14 2006. Nothing. Ron doesn't know how to discuss the issues. |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Dec 9 22:11:28 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Peter Rosa on Wed Dec 6 11:17:33 2006. While it starts and stops a lot, each quarter has a set amount of play, regardless of how many times they stop the clock. |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Sun Dec 10 08:56:53 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Dec 8 21:31:10 2006. So you're saying that the incredibly rude display of pushing and shoving that I witnessed when the track number was posted consisted only of Brooklyn(!) and Queens residents? |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Sun Dec 10 08:58:47 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sat Dec 9 07:18:14 2006. Really? Who said that?I said that LIRR riders (not "Long Islanders"), by and large, don't live in New York City. |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun Dec 10 22:03:20 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by David of Broadway on Sun Dec 10 08:58:47 2006. Olog: "Long Oylanders aren't New Yawkers?"David: "No, they're not. They don't live in New York City." |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun Dec 10 22:10:37 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by David of Broadway on Sun Dec 10 08:56:53 2006. No, I said nothing like that. I was responding to the comments that "Long Islanders are not New Yorkers?No they're not, they don't live in NYC"... As for the rude people, discussed elsewhere, I further also never even touched on the rudeness of anyone, Long Islanders, New Yorkers, Queens people, Brooklyn people or anyone. As for the rude display at Penn Station discussed (that I will now address), they consist of Nassau-Suffolk people, as well as Queens people. It happens just as much on lines with lots of Queens stations as it does on trains to lines with no Queens stations. "Methinks" it's more the method of the way they handle the track announcements at Penn Station than anything else. I always found it absurd that all these people have to be waiting at the top of stairways staring at screens, just waiting for a track number to be posted about 3 minutes before the train leaves, but that's another story/topic (and I am not meaning that as an excuse for rude displays at Penn Station either, just that I find fault with the way track numbers are announced) |
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Posted by RonInBayside on Sun Dec 10 22:31:00 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by American Pig on Sat Dec 9 03:08:57 2006. Certainly not westbound from Brooklyn :0) |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Mon Dec 11 01:28:15 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun Dec 10 22:10:37 2006. A large majority of LIRR riders are residents of Nassau and Suffolk.Even if the track is posted a mere 3 minutes before departure, 3 minutes is more than enough time to get down the stairs and onto the train. There's no need to push and shove; the worst that will happen is that you'll have to stand, and is it really worth demeaning yourself like that just to avoid having to stand? (You'll probably find a seat at Jamaica anyway. And this particular train left with lots of empty seats; nobody had to stand after all!) |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Dec 11 07:17:17 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by David of Broadway on Mon Dec 11 01:28:15 2006. large majority of LIRR riders are residents of Nassau and Suffolk.I never said anything to the contrary. All I was responding to was a statement that said "Long Islanders are not New Yorkers?" and an incorrect response that said "No they're not, they don't live in New York City". In fact, a MAJOR percentage of Long Island's population, DOES live in New York City. Poster 1: "I never understood why people think New Yorkers are rude until I saw Penn Station in the PM rush. Only one problem: those aren't New Yorkers." (Blanket statement translation, "those (all of those people) aren't New Yorkers"). Poster 2: "Long Oylanders aren't New Yawkers?" (many are, the entire population of Brooklyn and Queens are Long Islanders. There is no talk about LIRR riders, this is a straight out "Long Islanders (whether they ride the LIRR or not are not) New Yorkers?" Poster 1: "No, they're not. They don't live in New York City." (clearly false, as again, many Long Islanders do live in New York City....this is not talking about LIers that happen to use the LIRR). Anyway, as for the LIRR Penn Station stuff... Even if the track is posted a mere 3 minutes before departure, 3 minutes is more than enough time to get down the stairs and onto the train. There's no need to push and shove I am certainly not going to condone the display all the time at Penn Station, I know it well, but human nature is human nature. I stand by my statement that I find it absurd that they post the track numbers at Penn Station in the manner in which they do it. I still find it absurd that they make all these people hover over stairways staring at screens until the very last minute when they finally post a track number and then the mad dash down the stairs and along the platform. You see that anyway in the subway similarly (yes that would happen in the subway too if it was not known where the next train was going to leave from until just before the train arrives on whatever track). The only difference in the subway is that everyone always knows where the train will arrive, and the "mad dash" to the seats happens for only mere seconds (don't tell me you haven't ever seen people pushing and shoving the second the doors opened on a subway train in a mad dash for the seats - it's the same thing, only in that case it's mere seconds of rudeness as opposed to minutes running down stairs and along a platform as in the case of the way the MTA handles the track revelations at Penn Station). Again, I am certainly not condoning what happens at Penn Station, but I am also not going to say that non-NYC people are the only ones that do that, or are capable of that if they are dealt the same deck of cards to deal with everyday to get their trains. Or even say the false statement that ALL of those people aren't NYCers anyway. And this particular train left with lots of empty seats; nobody had to stand after all!) And if I am not mistaken, this particular train was a Far Rockaway train stopping at Woodside (maybe), Forest Hills (maybe), Kew Gardens (maybe), Jamaica, Locust Manor, Rosedale, Laurelton, Valley Stream, Gibson, Hewlett, Woodmere, Cedarhurst, Inwood, and Far Rockaway. There's an awful lot of NYC stations on that train too, you are not going to push all of that rudeness off on non-NYC people. |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Dec 11 07:19:16 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Dec 11 07:17:17 2006. Ooops, I forgot Lawrence next to Inwood. |
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Posted by Peter Rosa on Mon Dec 11 09:29:35 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Dec 11 07:17:17 2006. I stand by my statement that I find it absurd that they post the track numbers at Penn Station in the manner in which they do it. I still find it absurd that they make all these people hover over stairways staring at screens until the very last minute when they finally post a track number and then the mad dash down the stairs and along the platform.Mostly it's just the occasional riders who have to wait like that. As most rush hour trains use the same tracks each day, the regulars start forming their cows-at-the-slaughterhouse-chute half-moons ten or even fifteen minutes prior to departure. What's really amusing is the frantic, fall-of-Saigon rush that happens when there's a track change announcement at the last minute. My LIRR/NYCT blog |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Dec 11 09:48:14 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by Peter Rosa on Mon Dec 11 09:29:35 2006. Mostly it's just the occasional riders who have to wait like that. As most rush hour trains use the same tracks each day, the regulars start forming their cows-at-the-slaughterhouse-chute half-moons ten or even fifteen minutes prior to departure.Perhaps, but there has the be an AWFUL lot of non-regulars, as it is a stampede on any train I had to wait for there.... |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Mon Dec 11 09:54:29 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Dec 11 07:17:17 2006. I think you're reading a little too much into things. Nobody claims that every single New Yorker is perfectly polite while every Long Islander is downright rude. The claim (which I stand by) is that, by and large, New Yorkers are polite, and the common displays of rudeness that are often seen around the city are by and large committed by nonresidents of the city.The display I saw is repeated for pretty much every LIRR train out of Penn, at least in anything remotely resembling the PM rush. It doesn't matter how many of the stops on the train happen to be in New York City. (Even those trains that make many stops in Queens still carry mostly non-Queens residents, since the handful of Queens stops are mostly easily reachable by subway and have relatively low LIRR ridership. The only likely exception is the Port Washington Bra. Compare the normal LIRR crowds to the LIRR crowds during the transit strike last year.) When people rush to catch the subway, it's when it's leaving in three seconds, not three minutes. And people do it even when there are no empty seats -- in other words, it's not seats they're after; they simply want to catch the train. What happens when a seat empties up on the subway? Usually it sits empty for a few seconds (or minutes) until somebody standing nearby, seeing that nobody else wants it, claims it. Once in a while there's a slight conflict as two people aim for the same seat. I rarely see more than two -- unless you have a particularly good reason to sit, it's just not worth the trouble. |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Dec 11 10:16:09 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by David of Broadway on Mon Dec 11 09:54:29 2006. Well of course only LIRR residents use the stations in Nassau and Suffolk, just like only NYC people used the subway....Again, I am not at all condoning what happens at Penn Station (and I still feel it's because of that stupid way they display the tracks there at the last minute), my initial argument was merely against the "Long Islanders are not New Yorkers" controversy.... What happens when a seat empties up on the subway? Usually it sits empty for a few seconds (or minutes) until somebody standing nearby, seeing that nobody else wants it, claims it. Haha, oh please. |
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Posted by David of Broadway on Mon Dec 11 11:41:54 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Dec 11 10:16:09 2006. (scratches head) Why do you keep throwing in the word "only"? Do you not agree that the vast majority of LIRR passengers, especially outbound LIRR passengers around the PM rush, live in Nassau and Suffolk counties?Yes, part of New York City is technically on Long Island, so, technically, some New Yorkers are also Long Islanders. So what? What does that have to do with the discussion at hand? I ride the subway regularly. You ride the subway once every few months and reminisce over the times that you used to ride the subway regularly in the 80's and early 90's. I'm telling you what I actually see when seats empty up on the subway. Sometimes they go for several stops before they're refilled. A seat is really not a big deal for most subway passengers. (It is for me, incidentally, at least if I'm going to be on the train for more than a few stops, since I can work while I'm seated and because my job keeps me on my feet for hours at a time. But I'm the exception. Most commuters, for whom commuting time is nonproductive and who sit behind desks most of the day, like to have seats but don't make a big deal of it.) |
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Re: New York is doomed - more proof |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Mon Dec 11 12:06:42 2006, in response to Re: New York is doomed - more proof, posted by David of Broadway on Mon Dec 11 11:41:54 2006. A seat is really not a big deal for most subway passengers.While I don't think that's necessarily entirely true, I have to admit that I never care/cared when I get a seat on the subway. I always was/am a subway-stander the majority of the time, even when the train is empty. I usually always chose the side doors (side that will open least) even on underground lines. Yes, part of New York City is technically on Long Island, so, technically, some New Yorkers are also Long Islanders. So what? What does that have to do with the discussion at hand? Heh, I'm just yanking your chain. I know how you usually get with suburban vs city people, and caught you in a "Those Long Island people aren't NY(C)ers"... Truce? (see more below). The truth is, yes, the display at Penn Station is a stampede, and ridiculous, but it's unfortunately human nature. I still however, really do think it's because of the way the MTA displays the track number there, but I guess maybe that's another discussion. I think Grand Central is a little more tamer, but again, that could be because of the set up at Grand Central too, there are no stairs like at Penn, and it's a bit easier to get to your train, even if they do announce the track at the very last minute. This is not to be translated as Long Island people (LIRR users more specifically) are ruder than Connecticut or Westchester people (Metro North users specifically), I still feel it's the way things are handled at Penn Station, as well as the physical set up there. I still also feel the same would happen on the subway, but again, it's set up differently too, you have people on a platform, all spread as all the train doors open, as opposed to all these people horded at the top of a few stairways funneling down to a platform when the screen announces the track number. And I ride/rode the subway enough to know what happens when the trains are busy, and there are few available seats. That has not changed over the last decade, just as it hasn't changed over the last half of century. ....Anyway, as for being a "New Yorker", what was brought up in this thread. This is totally just a curiosity, not an argument starter, I really am curious about thoughts on this..... What constitutes a "New Yorker"? I think most people, whether it be Long Island, NYC itself, Westchester, etc usually associate themselves as "NYers". After all, NYC's suburbs are a part of the whole scheme of things. NYC could not survive without it's healthy suburbs (the way it does), nor can it's suburbs survive without a healthy NYC. So what is a "New Yorker"? Does a "New Yorker" necessarily mean "New York Citier"? I don't think so, but am curious about how it would be defined. I believe most people in let's say Nassau/Suffolk, Westchester, etc who are far from home in another place will almost always answer "Where are you from?" with a "From New York", implying that they are "NYers". Why would that be wrong? Some may from "I'm from Long Island", but from my experience, most will say "From New York". Food for thought.... |
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