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| Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction (582530) | |
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| (583852) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Sun Mar 9 21:49:00 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by FarRock on Sun Mar 9 21:34:01 2008. They say never say never, but Airtrain will NEVER make it to NYCT property unless the NYCT takes over it and uses their own equipmentYes. A future NYCT or LIRR takeover of AirTrain would impply the use of those agency's equipment and personnel. The PA would have to be kicked to the curb and its the latter that I don't see happening anytime soon. The system will most likely stay as is regardless of what politicians say and the $$$ wasted on "studies" for one-seat rides from JFK to Manhattan. The most likely scenario I would see happening is the JFK AirTrain to LIRR Main Line to NEC to Newark AirTrain run under the auspices of the Port Authority that I proposed in the previous post. The PA could charge distance-based fares under that scenario. |
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| (583855) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 9 21:57:56 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Sun Mar 9 21:29:43 2008. In my view, the heart of Sander's comments is noticing that un or underused ROW exists which can be made serviceable at far lower cost than miles of TBM work. I should point out that most of the CTA Orange Line to Midway is surplus mainline ROW. The ability to reclaim these routes at low land acquisition cost is important.My fave is the Bay Ridge to Hell Gate Br to the Bronx. As built in the 20's it was a 4 track route with passenger service, and I am most interested in linking Bklyn, Qns, and the Bronx because there are ever increasing reverse and outer to outer commutes which this could facillitate. |
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| (583859) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by monorail on Sun Mar 9 22:08:17 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun Mar 9 09:15:23 2008. then more tracks can be addedthere is ALWAYS a way around things..... |
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Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by monorail on Sun Mar 9 22:09:34 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Sun Mar 9 16:02:16 2008. 'They would take to the roads.'then the NIMBYS might allow other things...... |
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| (583887) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Sun Mar 9 23:13:46 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 9 21:57:56 2008. Yes, that route would be great indeed. I'm surprised he actually proposed that since it was never taken very seriously even here on SubChat whenever it was proposed by someone. I wonder what he has in mind for a Bronx terminal. |
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| (583888) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 9 23:25:46 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Sun Mar 9 23:13:46 2008. don't know, but I hope his POV is find useful stuff we can upgrade cheap. I have a dim memory of an early 80's trip from Boston to NYP where I saw what looked like station platform remains somewhere in the Bronx. Much has been erased through there since. BTW, there was a proposal 25 years ago to use the Bay Ridge to Hell Gate route. The Brooklyn resident put out a booklet which I have detailing the utiliy of a crosstown link improving access to Brooklyn College for several neighborhoods among other benefits.In my cynical view his plan while valid was damned at the outset because he was not a TA consultant or employee. This is why I am pleased that the "boss" is at least aware of the potential. |
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| (583899) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:38:34 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Edwards! on Sun Mar 9 20:04:46 2008. Seriously, LIRR is useful to only Howard Beach. Which if it wasn't for the need of faster Rockaway transport, I'd say is reason enough for making it LIRR. BUT, the Rockaways do need a faster way in, and the A train isn't gonna provide it. Q53 riders just got the royal screw job by having all the stops added(though it does help the Q11 big time), so that quick way into midtown is out now.Also, using airtrain on the ROW is a poor idea because then you can't serve the local neighborhoods. Perhaps, since the ROW was 4 tracks wide, you could run airtrain down the middle later on, but for now, it's subway time(unless you can get LRT across the 59th St into the 2nd Av trolley terminal) |
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| (583900) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:42:12 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Mar 9 21:57:56 2008. I just wonder how LRT would work. They need the NYCR during the day for the CSX freights that come into Fresh Pond. That's why I keep saying DMUs would be better. But yes, Bay Ridge to the Bx via the Hell Gate would be a great outerboro line. |
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| (583903) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:44:05 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Sun Mar 9 20:53:06 2008. Yes, but 3 cars is not enough to handle the passenger loads on the 8th Av line unless its 2am |
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Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:44:24 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by FarRock on Sun Mar 9 21:16:18 2008. Thank you |
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| (583905) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:45:20 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun Mar 9 18:50:32 2008. I know, but for those who have the opportunity to chose Sunnyside over NYP will do. I know I sure as hell would. Still, NJT hasn't even mentioned a possibility of serving Sunnyside |
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| (583907) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:48:42 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by FarRock on Sun Mar 9 19:54:37 2008. I've never really been a fan of that, but since I now know that airtrain was built to allow LIRR cars on it(which still baffles me a bit considering how tight some of those curves are), LIRR running some sort of two car trains(gapping problems?) express from midtown the airport seems like it would work. NYCT just doesn't have the time/space for a bunch of dinkys running around their system(not that the LIRR has an infinite amount of space either) |
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| (583910) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:50:43 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by monorail on Sun Mar 9 22:08:17 2008. You take a look at that ROW and tell me you can fit additional tracks through the entire thing. |
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| (583911) | |
Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:55:04 2008, in response to Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Sun Mar 9 21:06:10 2008. Airtrain could run down the center of the ROW. It was 4 tracks. Plus with it being mentioned that they're considering airtrain LGA-Woodside already, I see this as having some worth. Given that the ROW is there, I think it might actually be cheaper to have it run via the Rockaway ROW. The problem is along the LIRR, cuz you're already tryin to get a Queens super-express on the same ROW |
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| (583912) | |
Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:56:32 2008, in response to Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Mar 9 19:44:29 2008. That's why you send the local down to Ozone Park only until they build the super express. THEN, send the express down to the Rockaways |
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| (583915) | |
Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 00:03:56 2008, in response to Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by FarRock on Sun Mar 9 21:06:14 2008. Well, you just answered my question of what to do with the connections between the Rock, the Atlantic, and the lower montauk. You say airtrain won't work, you forget the ROW is 4 tracks wide. Connecting Airtrain to the Atlantic Av line at Jamaica might be impossible b/c of the Atlantic Av line goes into a tunnel before you get anywhere that there's space to place even a signle airtrain track.SO For Atlantic Av, run the airtrain down the center tracks and have it diverge onto the Atlantic Av line at Woodhaven where the connection is. |
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| (583923) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 01:01:19 2008, in response to Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NEPONSIT2006 on Fri Mar 7 18:00:11 2008. How about this:Phase 1: Extend V train to Ozone Park-101st St with stops at Fleet St, Parkside-Metropolitan Av, Brooklyn Manor-Jamaica Av, Woodhaven-Atlantic Av, Ozone Park-101st St Phase 2: SAS to Hanover Sq is finished Phase 3: Queens Super Express along LIRR from 63rd St tunnel to Rego Park with portal for an LIE branch for later. Extend branch of SAS from Hanover Sq through 63rd St, down super express with stops at Woodside, Winfield, Rego Park, and then the local Rockaway line stops all the way to Beach 116th St Phase 4: Connect middle express track/tracks to airtrain. Have some sort of hyrbrid cars(hybrid b/c I'm still not convinved the typical LIRR cars can handle those curves) run the HB branch, non-stop to ENY via the center tracks of the Rockaway, and the Atlantic Av line. After ENY, on to Flatbush, MAYBE with a stop at Nostrand for airport workers Phase 5: Continue "airtrain" express tracks to White Pot Jct with provisions for connection to LIRR mainline for service to Manhattan Here is teh map: http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&ll=40.694175,-73.813019&spn=0.22126,0.862427&z=11&msid=104471795667235493331.0004480d4f046626a3ef4 |
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| (583924) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Mar 10 01:02:44 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:42:12 2008. no, relegate CSX o the ATK tracks post 11PM when not much is running. As to the "transit", put the wires BACK and run EMUs. I have many times previously writen that a ConnDot service to Jamaica would do wonders for mobility all over. If the catenary on the Bay Ridge were replaced then EMUs could run on the ATK main which of course should be restored to the full four track configuration of classic PRR times. |
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| (583925) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 01:19:16 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Mar 10 01:02:44 2008. Umm, what about that stretch between where Amtrak branches off and the Fresh Pond yard? |
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| (583926) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by monorail on Mon Mar 10 01:38:25 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:50:43 2008. yesas stated before above what is there |
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| (583929) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 01:59:00 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by monorail on Mon Mar 10 01:38:25 2008. I'd even be opposed to that. Home owners will go nuts |
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| (583933) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Mar 10 02:27:52 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 01:19:16 2008. while I have no reference handy, I assume the was catenary under PRR. A friend who grew up in Brooklyn(60+) remembers NH freight Electrics in Bay Ridge. I certainly remember catenary visible from riding the N in the late 60s. |
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| (583934) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 02:41:49 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by monorail on Sun Mar 9 22:09:34 2008. the NIMBYs would like a train that actually goes somewhere so I propose to connect the Lower Montauk Line to the southern East River railroad tunnel to NYP and thru-run to NJ. The line would be electrified and road crossings would be eliminated. LIC terminal (which would become a station) and the rest of the line west of the Dutch Kills would be put underground. The MTA could finance some of this project by selling the air rights above the current LIC terminal and yard. In addition I would also run trains along this line that would use the Montauk Cutoff to Sunnyside Station/Yard. Diesels could use this service. |
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| (583936) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 02:51:23 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Mar 10 01:02:44 2008. Sander would like to run MNRR to NYP over the Amtrak/Hell Gate tracks as well. Also its the freight tracks that go to the NYCR and on to the Bay Ridge trackage. There really aren't too many ways around that short of some hellish switching. |
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| (583938) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 03:10:26 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:44:05 2008. Yes, but 3 cars is not enough to handle the passenger loads on the 8th Av line unless its 2amThat's a good point that I've been thinking about. The only answer to that is that they should consider having a guy on board collecting a premium fare of an extra dollar or two (a la JFK Express) to discourage non-airport bound passengers from current (A) stations. Riders with a plane ticket or an airport employee badge would be exempt from this premium. People boarding at the airport terminals, Federal Circle and the Employee Parking Station would also only pay the basic subway fare. In addition, since Metrocard turnstiles would be placed at the air terminals, people who are transfering between terminals to board another plane could show their ticket to an employee stationed near the turnstiles and enter for free thru a seperate gate. This should make 3-car trains sufficient to handle JFK bound crowds run at 12-15 minute headways. It would also allow the MTA to order specially-built trains with overhead racks, etc for luggage, giving the service an unique look so that passengers don't get on it by mistake. |
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| (583939) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 03:12:01 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:45:20 2008. Still, NJT hasn't even mentioned a possibility of serving SunnysideThe details for Sunnyside are very murky. I think that NJT would come around once more is known. |
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| (583950) | |
Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 03:54:48 2008, in response to Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:55:04 2008. Airtrain could run down the center of the ROW. It was 4 tracksYes it could but for the sake of NIMBY I would make it two tracked and give away the outer ROW to the adjacent residents for free as compensation for the trouble so that it could officially become part of their back yards. That would be a sweetener that might work. The problem is along the LIRR, cuz you're already tryin to get a Queens super-express on the same ROW If AirTrain went to NYCT standards you could have both the Super-Express AND the JFK-LGA link as you proposed it in addition to the (A)irTrain to Fulton/8th Av. Plus with it being mentioned that they're considering airtrain LGA-Woodside already, I see this as having some worth. It's an interesting idea but I don't see from where in Woodside a ROW to LGA can be run without encountering fierce NIMBYism. The only place that I can see where it might work is from east of Woodside Station and up the NYCR freight line and on to the the BQE-E and into LGA. That ROW however would end up bypassing major transfer points such as Woodside Station and thus defeat the purpose. If Sander decided to take on NIMBY it would be easier and cheaper to bring back the old (N/W) extension from Ditmars. |
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| (583951) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 03:59:30 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Mar 10 02:27:52 2008. But I'm saying it's single track. No way you're shiftin CSX operations down that line to Fresh Pond to night time hours. So what would you suggest doing there if this was to be light rail? |
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| (583952) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 04:01:49 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 03:10:26 2008. I'm not seein conductors working on a train that stops every 10 blocks. Sorry dude |
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| (583953) | |
Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 04:01:50 2008, in response to Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 23:56:32 2008. That's why you send the local down to Ozone Park only until they build the super express. THEN, send the express down to the RockawaysAgreed. I would actually turn the (V) into a two-directional circular line that would jump from the Old Rock unto the Jamaica El and then run via Willy B/Christie Cut up its current route. The Jamaica El could then be three-tracked with the (J) running a peak-direction express 18/6. Once the S-E is built, that section would have two services during the day. Most would take the S-E but those needing access to a QB or Brooklyn stop may prefer the (V). |
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| (583954) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 04:02:20 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 03:12:01 2008. Doubt it, but one can always hope |
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| (583955) | |
Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 04:03:30 2008, in response to Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 00:03:56 2008. For Atlantic Av, run the airtrain down the center tracks and have it diverge onto the Atlantic Av line at Woodhaven where the connection is.That's what Pataki and Co had in mind when they proposed the LIRR Lower Manhattan Access project. |
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| (583956) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 04:16:27 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 02:41:49 2008. You really need to think more about this.1. You can't get rid of LIC Yard. It's needed to store equipment during the day. There's just not enough space at WSY or any other place to store it all. 2. You can't just cut a hole in a tunnel that is lying in a river and feed another one into it. AFAIK it can't physically be done 3. You'd end up running LIRR into the NJT section 4. No capacity at NYP If you wanna do that, you'd have to connect it to the new lower level |
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| (583957) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 04:16:54 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 04:01:49 2008. They did it for the JFK Express. A three car train would actually make it easier on these employees. Its the only solution that I can think of to the problem of non-airport riders cramming on these trains. |
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| (583958) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 04:30:54 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 04:16:27 2008. It was a response to monorail's statement that NIMBYs would allow other things. They would allow what I proposed. As you mentioned, actually building it is a whole different matter. |
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| (583959) | |
Reopening LIRR White Pot Junction/other potential ripple effects |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Mon Mar 10 05:22:49 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Nyctransitman on Fri Mar 7 23:59:22 2008. To me:If this is done, then it would be best to have the V train serve this route. Given how many people avoid the V train as it is right now, it would make the most sense to make the V the train that serves this route if it happens. While this would kill my ideas of an M/V combo (which using the current line setups would still be the best option), if the V is sent down the Whitepot Junction, one thing I would then look at perhaps doing is having the M train once in Manhattan become an SAS route via a connection through Chrystie Street after the Essex Street station (once the phase to Houston Street is built), with the M in this scenario perhaps if Phase 2 is extended across 125th to Broadway-12th avenue becomes the line that goes there (which would also eliminate the need for the T train until Phase 4 is ready). |
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| (583964) | |
Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 06:58:20 2008, in response to Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 04:01:50 2008. V loop idea is pretty interesting, but is there capacity east of Myrtle for it? |
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| (583965) | |
Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 06:58:38 2008, in response to Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 06:58:20 2008. ooops, meant west of Myrtle |
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| (583966) | |
Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Mar 10 06:59:12 2008, in response to Re: LIRR/Airtrain Solution Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 04:03:30 2008. Yeah, but from what I could understand, they were talking about removing LIRR from the line |
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| (583979) | |
Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by trainsarefun on Mon Mar 10 07:56:40 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Mar 10 02:27:52 2008. There was catenary on the NYCR and Bay Ridge Branch under the NYNH&H, but that's long since been torn up. |
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| (583980) | |
Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by trainsarefun on Mon Mar 10 08:03:06 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 02:41:49 2008. the NIMBYs would like a train that actually goes somewhere so I propose to connect the Lower Montauk Line to the southern East River railroad tunnel to NYP and thru-run to NJ.Ridiculously expensive. All East River Tunnels are already on the descent by the time the trains are presently at LIC. No way that AMTK would or should allow LIRR to screw around with the East River Tunnels to bring even more congestion to NYP. |
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Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by trainsarefun on Mon Mar 10 08:04:35 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by trainsarefun on Mon Mar 10 08:03:06 2008. Now if you propose a new Manhattan station linking LIC form the east and HOB from the west, I'm with you |
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Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by trainsarefun on Mon Mar 10 08:08:11 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by SMAZ on Mon Mar 10 03:12:01 2008. NJT doesn't even run the ex-clocker trains into PHI - what makes you think they're going to add on an extra stop to start and end all runs bound for Sunnyside Yards at Sunnyside?Not to mention that stuff happens, and for whatever reason a train can get assigned to a different track at NYP and end up turning back to NJ before crossing to Queens. |
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| (583992) | |
Chrystie St/Second Ave Connection? |
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Posted by Qveensboro_Plaza on Mon Mar 10 09:11:18 2008, in response to Reopening LIRR White Pot Junction/other potential ripple effects, posted by Wallyhorse on Mon Mar 10 05:22:49 2008. Re Wallyhorse's comment:"...one thing I would then look at perhaps doing is having the M train once in Manhattan become an SAS route via a connection through Chrystie Street after the Essex Street station..." Does anyone know if the currently disused Chrystie Street link from Essex Street includes bellmouths or other structural work to enable a link to the eventual SAS? |
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| (584000) | |
Re: Chrystie St/Second Ave Connection? |
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Posted by shadyelstation on Mon Mar 10 09:27:52 2008, in response to Chrystie St/Second Ave Connection?, posted by Qveensboro_Plaza on Mon Mar 10 09:11:18 2008. I think there are provisions for such a connection, but not from Essex. IINM the provision is in the area north of Grand St on the (B)/(D) lines where the space b/w tracks widen. |
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Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Mar 10 10:58:08 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by NIMBYkiller on Sun Mar 9 18:45:25 2008. No it would not. You are full of beans.Only a minute fraction of LIRR trains will stop there in any event. Only a minute fraction of NJT trains would pass there let alone stop there. And only a minuscule minute fraction of rail patrons would want to use both companies for the same trip. As for this LION and his pride, we will travel into NYP on what ever train we choose, and there transfer to whatever other train we require at a time that is pleasing to us. [As if the LION had any use for either of those railroads in the first place.] The point is *so* moot it is pointless to pursue it under any circumstance. Now there *could* be a need, so we see, for NJT customers to be delivered to Sunnyside for their employment in Long Island City, if any, and likewise for LIRR customers for employment in the swamps of New Jersey, so direct (non-connecting) service may be interesting, but of course the Hudson Tunnels have not the capacity for this business, and the East River Tunnels are only a little better since NJT already has trains running to layup there. But as a reliable customer service? LION cannot see it. As a matter of plain fact, the EAGLE has told me that he cannot see it either, and EAGLE has the sharpest eyesight of all the beasties. ROAR |
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| (584052) | |
The LION's Plan: Was: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Mar 10 11:31:55 2008, in response to Re: Thus Spake the LION: Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Edwards! on Sun Mar 9 20:04:46 2008. That line is NOT LIRR property, NYC and/or NYCT can do with it as they please. Heck, they can park school buses on it if they want to!If someone wants LIRR to operate on that line, then I guess it becomes an LIRR affair. But we [the LION and his PRIDE] see this happening not. If a subway line then the LION has an idea:  This presumes: 1) That a new subway was built along Northern Boulevard to alleviate congestion on the (7) train. 2) That the (R) train will serve Roosevelt Avenue out to Flushing Main Street. Thus the existing service from Times Square and Grand Central can be re routed as shown above, with one train making its way via LIE and the old Rockaway line to JFK and can then make the rounds there. This line would indeed be built to AirTrain specifications and will use AirTrain equipment to and from Javits Center, TS and GCT as a non-stop airport service. Other equipment will serve to Howard Beach, probably also to the Rockaways, and an addidional service to FLB via the LIE. The FLB/LIE service would serve new park and ride stations almost exclusively. The (A) train would no longer serve Howard Beach or the Rockaways but would be exclusive to Lefferts (well as extended via Supthin to Hillside.) ROAR |
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Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Mar 10 12:06:00 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Sun Mar 9 13:50:49 2008. Not that much, remember how the connection at 36th St. was built, and that was more complicated. It would probably take 15-20 years to build, though. |
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Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Mar 10 12:08:01 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Broadway Lion on Sun Mar 9 15:09:26 2008. Haven't you heard. Global Warming has been repealed; there is more snow pack in Siberia and in China than there has been in 50 years, and the ice has returned to the polar ice cap. The Polar Bears love it, the bi-polar bears are not so sure. No, this is news to me, probably because it ISN'T news to the MSM. |
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Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Mon Mar 10 13:04:13 2008, in response to Re: Re-Open LIRR 'White Pot Junction, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Mar 9 12:51:25 2008. Perhaps it's time to add some tracks to the Queens Blvd line. Like 2 express tracks underneath the current ROW. This could be done without major service interruptions, and said tracks could veer off in Rego Park and run south to the Rockaways. On the other side, they could feed the 63rd St. tunnel, making it far more useful. F to the Rockaways via 63rd, V replaces F out to 179th, express between QP and Forest Hills, and the G is restored to Continental.Crazy? Crazy expensive? 1) Why underpin the existing subway instead of running direct under Queens Blvd? 2) Seeing as you have a branch diverging at Woodhaven Blvd, it would be sensible to make that the local and use the four express tracks for eastern Queens (a much more effective use of express capacity). This avoids new tunnels for very little gain in capacity between Woodhaven and Continental. 3) The branch at Woodhaven would arguably be better turning north-east along the LIE rather than south-east along the Rockaway Branch. 4) Restoring the G to the Local is a must with one express using all the capacity of the 53rd St tunnel and the other all the capacity of the 63rd St tunnel. The R train alone would not be enough. |
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