|
|
| Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map (1002074) | |
 |
|
| Home > SubChat | |
[ Post a New Response | Return to the Index ]
|
| (1002074) | |
Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by X-Astorian on Fri Nov 12 12:33:50 2010 The map below dates from between May 1941 (start of the Dyre Avenue Line) and June 1942 (end of the Second Avenue El). All seems as it should except for the following oddities:(1) The Culver Line is shown as dual BMT/IND service. While it was always the intention for the IND to take over the Culver is anyone aware of a plan for dual service? (2) After the Fulton Street and Fifth Avenue Els stopped in 1940, the Myrtle and Lex continued to serve Park Row until they were cut back to Bridge-Jay in March 1944. This map shows the lines ending at Sands Street, not Park Row. Again, is anyone aware of a plan to use Sands Street as the El terminal after 1940 or for that matter, after March 1944? In any event, I hope you enjoy this odd relic.  |
|
|
| (1002080) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by BMTLines on Fri Nov 12 12:48:10 2010, in response to Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by X-Astorian on Fri Nov 12 12:33:50 2010. I never heard of any plans for a joint Culver service. |
|
|
| (1002083) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Nov 12 13:01:52 2010, in response to Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by X-Astorian on Fri Nov 12 12:33:50 2010. I think this map assumes two things that the coming of WWII delayed: the IND takeover of the Culver line by the IND and the removal of el trains on the Brooklyn Bridge. |
|
|
(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
|
| (1002092) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Randyo on Fri Nov 12 13:25:30 2010, in response to Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by X-Astorian on Fri Nov 12 12:33:50 2010. If you look carefully, it also seems to show the IND line between ENY and Euclid as being joint IND/BMT which unlike the Culver, it really never could have been since no track connection was planned at that location. Moreover, the IND Fulton St Line did not go past Rockaway Av until after WWII so that part of the map should never have been included except possibly as being under construction as was the case with the mid 1950s map that showed the connection to the Fulton St El as being under construction. It also shows the Dyre Av Line as being IRT which despite the use of IRT el cars was at that time legally part of the IND Division and operated with IND supervision and crews. |
|
|
| (1002098) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Nov 12 13:35:33 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Randyo on Fri Nov 12 13:25:30 2010. I thought B'way ENY opened in 1945, before the war ended, but apparently not.BTW, this claims the Broadway ENY station was equipped with fluorescent lighting since it opened, but that's not true. It had old fashioned incandescents well into the 1980's. |
|
|
| (1002099) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by GIS Man on Fri Nov 12 13:36:39 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Randyo on Fri Nov 12 13:25:30 2010. They might as well have added (dare I say it?) 76th St.Bob |
|
|
| (1002100) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by znufrii on Fri Nov 12 13:38:03 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Randyo on Fri Nov 12 13:25:30 2010. To me, that looks like a dashed line to indicate it was under construction, nut the multi-colored line that would indicate joint service. |
|
|
| (1002101) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Nov 12 13:42:01 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by znufrii on Fri Nov 12 13:38:03 2010. The map clearly states this was meant to show "IND and BMT service". This does not mean joint service, though. I think the mapmakers were just trying to show an imminent changeover that, due to other events, would be delayed for another decade. |
|
|
| (1002122) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Randyo on Fri Nov 12 14:51:33 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Nov 12 13:35:33 2010. That article from NYC subway.org doesn't really make it clear one way or the other but it was definitely the last IND station built with the older style tiles, incandescent lights and a conventional GRS lever machine. I also question the comment that the station tile was olive green even though I've seen it many times before reconstruction and can't recall. However, since the tiles between Shepherd and Liberty are blue (indigo, actually), it would seem that the original tiles at ENY would have also been that color since that would be the color that fit the IND station color pattern. |
|
|
| (1002126) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Randyo on Fri Nov 12 14:57:54 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Nov 12 13:42:01 2010. The large Hagstrom station maps that were installed circa 1946 that still showed the IND Court St Shuttle and the 3 Av El to Freeman St showed the Culver as being entirely an IND line. These maps, however had a small service guide label pasted in the lower left hand corner of them to indicate among other things that the IND Culver Line was under temporary BMT operation between Ditmas Av and Coney Island. Additional notices indicated that 3 Av El service to Freeman St had been discontinued and the IND shuttle between Court St and Hoyt was not in operation. |
|
|
| (1002129) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Mr RT on Fri Nov 12 15:03:35 2010, in response to Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by X-Astorian on Fri Nov 12 12:33:50 2010. I stayed there in the 60's while looking for an apartment to rent. |
|
|
| (1002225) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by G1Ravage on Fri Nov 12 22:02:47 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Mr RT on Fri Nov 12 15:03:35 2010. At Seamen's House? |
|
|
| (1002272) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Mellow One on Fri Nov 12 23:54:02 2010, in response to Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by X-Astorian on Fri Nov 12 12:33:50 2010. This is the first time that I have seen the truncated Second Ave El on a NYC Subway map. Was there an official map of this time period produced and put in use?The Sands St Terminal is certainly a mystery. Was ther ever any routing of the Lexington Ave or Broadway Line out to the remaining Fulton El or the Canarsie Line? |
|
|
| (1002274) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by X-Astorian on Sat Nov 13 00:07:28 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Mellow One on Fri Nov 12 23:54:02 2010. "Was ther ever any routing of the Lexington Ave or Broadway Line out to the remaining Fulton El or the Canarsie Line?"Fulton-Lexington service ran to Grant Avenue until the demise of the Lex in 1950. |
|
|
| (1002298) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by gbs on Sat Nov 13 03:07:58 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Randyo on Fri Nov 12 14:51:33 2010. The correct IND color at Broadway-EastNY (and Liberty Av etc.) should have been, but never was, purple, not olive green or any kind of blue. In the original sequence, red was the last color and was properly followed by the first color, purple, to start the sequence again.Compare: red 34 St, purple 42 St (8th Av); red 182-183 St, purple Fordham Rd (Concourse); red 169 St, purple 179 St (Hillside Av); red Rockaway Av, purple Broadway-EastNY (oops!). Maybe one day they'll remove that awful orange/blue add-on stripe installed on the platform walls at 179 St (symbolizing 6th and 8th Avenue service to that station, when both the E and F ran there regularly) and reveal again the beautiful purple tile stripe (similar to Euclid Avenue's purple stripe, though incorrect at Euclid, which should have been blue, the second color of the original sequence). |
|
|
| (1002432) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Mellow One on Sat Nov 13 09:40:49 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by X-Astorian on Sat Nov 13 00:07:28 2010. Very Interesting. When you compare this 1941/42 map with the 1939 system map at NYCSubway.org, you see all the Brooklyn Els intact to Park Row and El routes are identified on the Broadway Line from Delancey to ENY and out to Canarsie. All the Coney Island Lines are El routes (from the 5th Ave Line) except the Sea Beach (from the 4th Ave Subway) and a El stub to the Sea Beach is shown north of Stillwell. The Franklin Line is an El route to Prospect Park. However, the El route picks up or ends at Ave H on the Brighton Line. |
|
|
| (1002612) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Elkeeper on Sat Nov 13 16:27:11 2010, in response to Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by X-Astorian on Fri Nov 12 12:33:50 2010. Perhaps, they were considering a joint el/trolley station at Sands Street? With the streetcars using the tracks like they did from 1944-1950 and the Park Row el terminal no longer needed. |
|
|
| (1002719) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Sat Nov 13 21:49:53 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by gbs on Sat Nov 13 03:07:58 2010. And Red - 23rd-Ely, Purple - Queens Plaza; Red -47/50 and 5th Ave (53rd), Purple (7th Ave) as well.The original color chart of IND lines (pg.51, Subway Style and property of the Transit Museum) shows this error as well - red (Rockaway) followed by blue then by purple. The color specified for these stations, including Broadway Junction is actually the lighter two-tone blue found at the local stops. And the color for Grant is shown as the same purple as Euclid - NOT green. However - a pencil notation in the grid shows "Green SC" (Soldier Course) and a question mark to the right. The tile at Broadway Junction AS very likely always blue from day one. It just appeared to be greenish due to the fact that under the incandescents, it absorbed the yellowish light (the center of the tile band is matte, so the light doesn't reflect much) and thus appeared to be dark green. A heavy coat of grime didn't help either. I do suppose that the text of that article needs to be amended. Regarding "indigo" blue at the local stops - the shade there is much lighter than indigo. Indigo is to blue as the funeral grape at Queens Plaza is to purple. The right shades are more like cornflower blue (just this side of ultramarine blue) (border) and blue lake or cerulean blue (centers). Very appealing, especially under the pinkish (warm) flourescent light. wayne |
|
|
| (1002781) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by gbs on Sun Nov 14 01:28:20 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Sat Nov 13 21:49:53 2010. The blue at the local stations east of Broadway-EastNY is indeed attractive, but the "white" wall tiles are too yellowish. Maybe they looked better under incandescent lights, but they don't look too nice today.I remember that when I was a kid (before I figured out the IND color sequence), Queens Plaza and Roosevelt Av looked like the same dark bluish-purplish color under the incandescent lights. The fluorescents installed in the '70s made the purple/blue distinction clear. |
|
|
| (1002835) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 14 09:35:10 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Mellow One on Sat Nov 13 09:40:49 2010. Very confusing how they shoe el routes on the 1939 route. Can't understand using their definitions why the Brighton line is shown as an el south of Avenue H unless some service ended there which it did not. If that is an el, then White Plains Road needs to be an el. Also why is there no connection shown between Broadway and the Myrtle Avenue els? |
|
|
| (1002837) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by BMTLines on Sun Nov 14 09:56:40 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 14 09:35:10 2010. If you look at the BMT maps of that period, they too did not differentiate between elevated services vs subway services. Note the lines in blue vs the lines in red and you see the same thing south of Avenue H on the Brighton line. It is in blue which meant that it was physically elevated south of that point. North of that point the line is in red meaning that it is either subway or at grade. I suspect the map makers of the map in question in this thread simply copied the official BMT definitions. In terms of service patterns that kind of differentiation between subway/surface and el really was meaningless but that was for later mapmakers to figure out |
|
|
| (1002889) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Nov 14 11:29:22 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Nov 14 09:35:10 2010. I think this map uses the el moniker to denote any structure that is a physical el. No el service ran to Canarsie, or on the West End line, but both lines are physically elevated. The Sea Beach line and the Brighton north of Ave. H is in a cut. |
|
|
| (1002892) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Mitch45 on Sun Nov 14 11:38:51 2010, in response to Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by X-Astorian on Fri Nov 12 12:33:50 2010. This map was printed in 1941 and the connection from the IND to the Culver El wasn't completed until 1954. Perhaps joint service was intended in 1941 but discarded by 1954. |
|
|
| (1003026) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Randyo on Sun Nov 14 19:03:31 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by gbs on Sun Nov 14 01:28:20 2010. One of the inconsistencies I have noticed on the IND is that on occasion, a color is missing from the sequence and some colors are duplicated. For example, going south from 207, the next express station 168 St is re, followed by 145 St which is a shade somewhere between orange and yellow and the next is 125 St which is green. I have not seen anywhere on the IND where both an orange and a yellow is in the sequence. It is either one or the other but not both. Some express stations even duplicate the sequence such a 50/6 and 42/6 which are both orange and also Bway/Laff and 2 Ave which were originally the same shade of light blue until Bway/Laff was retiled. |
|
|
| (1003033) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Randyo on Sun Nov 14 19:18:32 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Nov 14 11:29:22 2010. That 1939 map is fraught with errors including the connection shown between the 14 St Line and the Myrtle el rather than between the Bway Bkln el and Myrtle. It also fails to show the express and local stations on the Bway Bkln El and fails to indicate Utica on the IND A Line as an express stop while showing Nostrand as an express stop. It also shows express and local stops on the IND Smith St Line even though the IND had no express service at all in Bkln at the time. Also, while it shows some of the IRT and BMT lines in the outer boroughs as elevated lines, it shows the IRT Pelham and portions of the Wh Pl Rd line as subway lines. That map was obviously made by someone with less than no knowledge of the NYC transit system and it's unfortunate that some passengers who were unfamiliar with the system had to rely on maps like that. |
|
|
| (1003245) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by gbs on Mon Nov 15 02:39:32 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Randyo on Sun Nov 14 19:03:31 2010. Except for the duplicate red-orange (the red family) at 42/6 and 50/6, which apparently had to be done to get the 6 Avenue line to sync with the 7 Av and 5 Av colors already in place, the others you mention are all correctly in sequence.The yellow-orange at 145/8 (similar to the original color at 14/8) is in the yellow family, the next-to-last color in the sequence, before red. So going north from Chambers on the 8 Av line: Chambers: purple Canal (and Spring): blue W4: green 14 (and 23): yellow 34: red 42 (and 50): purple 59 (and 72-116): blue 125 (and 135): green 145 (and 155, 163): yellow 168 (and 175-207): red On 6 Av north from W4: W4 (and 14, 23): green 34: yellow (originally; some vestiges left) 42 & 50: red Bway-Lafayette was a lighter blue than today, but always correctly blue; 2 Av was and is the correct purple. South of 2 Av and south of Chambers, every station is purple until blue Jay St, then green Bergen and Hoyt, yellow 7 Av and Nostrand, red Church and Utica.... Some of the yellow stations are yellow-orange (Ft Hamilton Pkwy), but Sutphin Blvd/Hillside is quite a light yellow. Some have brown borders (the original 34/6) and others black (Union Tpke). |
|
|
| (1003279) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Mr RT on Mon Nov 15 08:01:27 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by G1Ravage on Fri Nov 12 22:02:47 2010. Yep, YMCA in mid-town ... thought it was called Sloan House ? |
|
|
| (1003362) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by X-Astorian on Mon Nov 15 11:17:14 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Mr RT on Mon Nov 15 08:01:27 2010. "Yep, YMCA in mid-town ... thought it was called Sloan House ?"Sloan House (which also printed many promotional subway maps) was at 34th Street and 9th Avenue. |
|
|
| (1003400) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Randyo on Mon Nov 15 13:45:49 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by gbs on Mon Nov 15 02:39:32 2010. True, but there are no occasions where there are both a distinct yellow and a distinct orange following each other. As far as Bway/Laff and 2 Av are concerned, 2 Av and the following stations don't look purple to me at all but the same shade of blue that was originally at Bway/Laff. |
|
|
| (1003418) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Mon Nov 15 14:12:52 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Randyo on Mon Nov 15 13:45:49 2010. Broadway-Lafayette had a tile band much closer to that at the Court Street station (Transit museum) - the center was lighter (powder blue) and the edge was very similar (Court Street leans a bit more towards aquamarine). 2nd Avenue through York Street all had the same color as installed (Delancey's has been altered during rehab) - two tone violet, with the edge slightly darker than the center. York Street appears to have faded somewhat over time, giving it a bluish tint. Delancey Street (current color blue-violet lake) original color survives in the tablets.I suppose the mustard yellow at 7th Avenue ("F") followed by the spanish orange (15th Street) followed by the orange-yellow (Fort Hamilton) qualifies for the above. Also - on the Queens IND - the express stations are always a shade (or a few shades) darker than the local stations - with the first local stop after the color change being lighter than the rest, varying slightly darker towards the express stops. wayne |
|
|
| (1003475) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Randyo on Mon Nov 15 16:53:35 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Mon Nov 15 14:12:52 2010. Since you brought up York St, does anyone know why it has 1950s style tiles like the stations S/O ENY and the original tiles at 179 St rather than the older pre WWII style tiles? |
|
|
| (1003637) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by gbs on Tue Nov 16 01:18:40 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Randyo on Mon Nov 15 13:45:49 2010. That's because there was no "orange" family in the original IND sequence:purple, blue, green, yellow, red Sometimes the yellow stations were yellowish-orange (like 145/8), which counted as the yellow in the sequence, and sometimes the red stations were red-orange (like 169/Hillside), which counted as the red in the sequence. The closest you can come to both a dark yellow and a pure yellow nearby is the Union Tpke - Van Wyck Blvd - Sutphin Blvd series. They all count as the yellow between the green of 71-Continental and the red (well, red-orange) of Parsons. |
|
|
| (1003710) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Nov 16 09:19:35 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Randyo on Sun Nov 14 19:18:32 2010. Agreed. Just too many inconsistencies in that map. The BMT map used a different definition of el which at least was consistent. I actually like that map because there wasn't such a big distinction between subway and el (heavy wide line for subway and thin black line for el. You can tell by that distinction how subways were thought of as superior to els that if only part of the line was a subway, the entire line got to be called a subway.) |
|
|
| (1003720) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Tue Nov 16 09:31:32 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Randyo on Mon Nov 15 16:53:35 2010. It's actually a stylistic variant - similar to what is found on some of the Concourse stations (i.e.167th Street) with a "running bond" (brickwork) rather than the standard bond tiles. Only one of its kind in the system, with the captions placed over the tile band (only one tile in height, with borders). Not sure why they did it this way, as opposed to what was done at High Street or Broadway-Nassau. Perhaps they were trying a different design approach for the trackside ceiling and wall.wayne |
|
|
| (1003730) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Tue Nov 16 09:42:58 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by gbs on Tue Nov 16 01:18:40 2010. Sometimes the reds could veer off in the other direction - towards purple, as is found at Utica Avenue (Fulton Street). And purple could actually get closer to red (the original Plum colored tiles at Chambers Street-H&M). The five basic spectral families remain unchanged.wayne |
|
|
| (1003940) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Randyo on Tue Nov 16 14:18:09 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by gbs on Tue Nov 16 01:18:40 2010. According to some of the documentation I have seen, the color tiles were supposed to follow the colors of the spectrum which includes both yellow and orange yet for some reason that was never done in actual practice. |
|
|
| (1004189) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by gbs on Wed Nov 17 00:59:46 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Tue Nov 16 09:42:58 2010. That deep burgundy-red at Utica et seq. (and formerly at 34/8, 5/53 lower, and Tremont) is a gorgeous, rich color, much classier than the flat red-orange seen elsewhere.Utica is a beautiful station, because of both the original color and the spectacular artwork and decorations. If only the platforms weren't so deep, requiring the exiting passengers to climb unnecessarily high. The second-system shell should have been built under the first-system station, not above. Why put the speculative station above the certain station? One of the few IND mis-steps.... |
|
|
| (1004243) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by William A. Padron on Wed Nov 17 08:09:49 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by gbs on Wed Nov 17 00:59:46 2010. >>That deep burgundy-red at Utica et seq. (and formerly at 34/8, 5/53 lower, and Tremont) is a gorgeous, rich color,<<This may surprise some, but a portion of the original tiling at Tremont Avenue on the IND Concourse line (including with the some of the lettering blocks) had been exposed. This was caused by a steam water pipe that somehow burst out, and made some of the redone tiles to pop off the original surface and go on the tracks. It can be seen currently towards the north end of the station on the side wall of the uptown local track. By the way, the deep burgundy red tile color band was also seen at the BMT Nassau Street Line's Fulton Street station, but it had all been covered up in the mid-1990's rehabiliation with BRT-style designed wall tiles. -William A. Padron ["TREMONT"] |
|
|
| (1004492) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Wed Nov 17 13:19:37 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by William A. Padron on Wed Nov 17 08:09:49 2010. Lest we forget all of the Maroons - Church Avenue.-w- |
|
|
| (1004535) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Randyo on Wed Nov 17 14:45:18 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by gbs on Wed Nov 17 00:59:46 2010. Actually, if you notice, all of the IND second system lines were to be above the existing lines rather than below. That actually makes sense since at the time the IND was built, cut and cover was the primary construction method and it would have been easier to connect portions of new lines to a station structure above an existing mainline without disturbing the lines already in operation. Roosevelt upper, So 4 St, Utica, and the portion of the Worth St Subway at E Bway are all above the operating infrastructures. The station shell at 2 Av is also designed so that the SAS as originally planned would have been above the Houston St Line. |
|
|
| (1004794) | |
Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Thu Nov 18 08:05:13 2010, in response to Re: Oddities in an early 1940s Subway Map, posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Wed Nov 17 13:19:37 2010. Choich Ave. - why soitenly!:) |
|
|
