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| Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing (1179922) | |
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| (1190223) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:54:46 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Jun 1 19:34:20 2014. We need both sides of thought, because no thought is always correctSome are. But humans have a tendency to reject what is right and go down stupid paths. Karl Marx was one. |
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| (1190225) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:56:39 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Jun 1 20:34:25 2014. when I see bluster from the right. . . you're imagining things and reacting out of your leftist conditioning. |
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| (1190226) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:56:55 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by gp38/r42 chris on Sun Jun 1 21:05:41 2014. Please describe "bluster from the right". |
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| (1190227) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:58:00 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by chicagomotorman on Sun Jun 1 19:30:12 2014. Nobody on the left does. They want things to be like Red China, because they think that the Almighty State won't bother them due to their "correct" thinking. |
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| (1190249) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Nilet on Sun Jun 1 22:36:47 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:56:55 2014. Please define "right." |
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| (1190250) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Nilet on Sun Jun 1 22:36:48 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:58:00 2014. Nobody on the right does. They want things to be like China, because they think that the Almighty State won't bother them due to their "correct" thinking.Fixed that for you. |
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| (1190275) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Jun 1 23:54:06 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:56:55 2014. lol! |
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| (1190276) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Jun 1 23:54:31 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:56:39 2014. Uh ... sure. Nice to meet you. :) |
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| (1190279) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Jun 2 00:04:15 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:54:46 2014. Yep ... supply-side being one of the dumbest ones when bankers don't know how to change a toilet ring or adjust the timing on their BMW. Some day, labour will do their own reverse Ayn Rand and let them pick their own vegetables and dig out their own septic tank so they can see the value inherent in other people's work for a change. |
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| (1190282) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Jun 2 00:07:28 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jun 1 21:58:00 2014. You could use a trip to camp ... it's summer yaknow. :) |
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| (1190407) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Mon Jun 2 11:03:00 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by bingbong on Fri May 30 15:23:06 2014. Fast food chains feed the poor.If you don't want to feed the poor you must be a role model in compassion. And why stop with the "decent legal wage", whatever you deem that to be to be slow and rude at work. Why not go back to the days when business provided room and board instead of wages, but forced you to go to church on Sundays and had employee curfews? Or do we just pick and choose what bullcrap to spout today? |
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| (1190410) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by bingbong on Mon Jun 2 11:13:31 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by orange blossom special on Mon Jun 2 11:03:00 2014. LOL! Hardly, excepting an employee bringing home a bag of "burgers" once a week or so. Fast food chins don't accept SNAP.Got a problem with a living wage for all? You shouldn't. You should have BIG problems with restrictions on how employees, free people, live, including their CHOICE of religious expression, or NOT. A VERY big problem. You sound like Olog. |
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| (1190432) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by vfrt on Mon Jun 2 13:41:45 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Jun 1 17:31:43 2014. Is there a tomato-loaders union?http://momentummachines.com/gallery/ |
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| (1190435) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by G1Ravage on Mon Jun 2 14:02:12 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri May 30 16:45:57 2014. Thank you for making sense. You're certainly one of the more rational Democrats on this board. |
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| (1190445) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Jun 2 15:26:32 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri May 30 16:45:57 2014. The politicians you keep backing don't feel the same way. |
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| (1190479) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Jun 2 17:18:08 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by vfrt on Mon Jun 2 13:41:45 2014. The automation industry is WAY ahead of ya, yo ... :)
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| (1190501) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Jun 2 20:25:13 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Jun 2 17:18:08 2014. They have machines that always vend what you pay for, or your money back. |
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| (1190502) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Jun 2 20:26:17 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by G1Ravage on Mon Jun 2 14:02:12 2014. Yeah, but despite that I still believe in raising the minimum wage.Actually, I would rather the minimum wage be abolished, but only if a guaranteed minimum income scheme were implemented in its stead. |
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| (1190525) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Mon Jun 2 22:37:17 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by Nilet on Sun Jun 1 15:02:03 2014. good post.Rich people are more unethical. They want to screw over the workers. |
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| (1190527) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Jun 2 22:38:20 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by LuchAAA on Mon Jun 2 22:37:17 2014. FALSE |
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| (1190536) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Jun 2 23:01:38 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Jun 2 20:25:13 2014. Not ... always. :)
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| (1190538) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by Rockparkman on Mon Jun 2 23:03:48 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by LuchAAA on Mon Jun 2 22:37:17 2014. Most of them don't want to screw their employees |
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| (1190572) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Jun 3 00:57:38 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by LuchAAA on Mon Jun 2 22:37:17 2014. Yeah, that's why they give them jobs, right?It's the politicians that want to screw the workers, not the employers. |
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| (1190614) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by TerrApin Station on Tue Jun 3 07:22:52 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Jun 2 22:38:20 2014. Iawtp |
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| (1190617) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by Fred G on Tue Jun 3 07:46:03 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by busdude2 on Sun Jun 1 14:46:55 2014. The amount you get paid for a job is what you've negotiated and NOT some value that your skill has. Were minimum wage workers actually successful in banding together and unionizing, their collective bargaining for a higher wage would win the day for them.Honestly, when it's lunchtime, I want a person to fix me lunch and not write software or compose a memo. That lunch dude is wayyyy more valuable :) your pal, Fred |
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| (1190622) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Tue Jun 3 07:54:50 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by LuchAAA on Mon Jun 2 22:37:17 2014. That is totally false. They NEED their employees for one, and no, most do not want to "screw" them over. Now you sound like the looney far left. |
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| (1190638) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by Nilet on Tue Jun 3 09:22:23 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by Olog-hai on Tue Jun 3 00:57:38 2014. Yeah, that's why they give them jobs, right?So would you claim that slaveowners neither intended to nor actually did screw over their slaves? After all, they gave them "jobs." It's the politicians that want to screw the workers, not the employers. Those politicians are owned by the employers and doing their bidding. |
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| (1190645) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by Nilet on Tue Jun 3 09:43:28 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by LuchAAA on Mon Jun 2 22:37:17 2014. All people are inherently self-interested. Altruism and morality only exist because those are in our self-interest (no matter what Ayn Rand has to say). If all of us agree to be moral and altruistic, then we're all better off for it. Said agreement can be enforced through social pressure, reciprocity, and the creation and enforcement of laws.Rich people are sufficiently shielded from social pressure, are sufficiently well-off that they don't need to rely on reciprocated altruism, and sufficiently able to control, subvert, or escape the influence of the law. Since they don't gain personally from being altruistic or moral, they revert to strictly selfish behaviour. Basically, in a one-off situation, morality and altruism is a prisoner's dilemma, where every rational person chooses the greedy or immoral option, hoping everyone else decides to be altruistic and moral but figuring greed is the better option either way. However, society is a decidedly ongoing affair, making altruism and morality into more of an iterated prisoner's dilemma, where cooperation is better over the long term as immoral behaviour forfeits future rewards; be the asshole who takes without giving and people stop giving. However, that assumes everyone starts on a roughly equal playing field and must obey the same rules. At best, a rich person has no need for the reward from mutual cooperation, and at worst the rich person can compel the other "player" to act against his own self-interest. So basically, rich people are no more likely to be assholes than anybody else— they're just free of the social pressures that keep everyone else's innate assholery (relatively) in check. |
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| (1190686) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Tue Jun 3 12:28:31 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by Fred G on Tue Jun 3 07:46:03 2014. "The amount you get paid for a job is what you've negotiated and NOT some value that your skill has."This is fundamentally wrong. What you get paid for is the convergence of your economic "worth" and labor demands. When there are a hundred illegals waiting to do your job, you're not worth much and can be replaced. When you don't have a moron for president and have full employment, you get a raise. You don't even need to waste your free time unionizing*, because the raise will go through prior to them. Negotiating are only allowed for professionals, not the lunch dude. More than half of people graduating from college this year won't get to negotiate a salary. They will only be paid the going rate depending on how many apply. *When did unions become all about greed and an extra dollar and hour than the whole workplace environment? Oh yea, when we put teachers and SSA workers on the save par as miners. |
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| (1190687) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Tue Jun 3 12:30:25 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by Nilet on Sun Jun 1 15:02:03 2014. You never read your paycheck I can see. |
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| (1190691) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by Nilet on Tue Jun 3 12:32:55 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by orange blossom special on Tue Jun 3 12:30:25 2014. I'm afraid you're deluded. |
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| (1190722) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Jun 3 14:46:46 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by Fred G on Tue Jun 3 07:46:03 2014. Honestly, when it's lunchtime, I want a person to fix me lunch and not write software or compose a memoReady to cough up $20 per lunch? |
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| (1190926) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Wed Jun 4 12:08:10 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by Nilet on Tue Jun 3 12:32:55 2014. claiming you don't work for the customer isn't being deluded. sure.Please use that in a job interview. |
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| (1190934) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny... |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Jun 4 12:19:46 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, we should try again to eliminate the penny..., posted by orange blossom special on Wed Jun 4 12:08:10 2014. I never said anything of the sort. Please read my post and try again. |
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| (1190976) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by streetcarman1 on Wed Jun 4 15:52:45 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by bingbong on Fri May 30 18:57:27 2014. They all went overseas.....where they pay less and give no benefits overseas. |
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| (1190980) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Train Dude on Wed Jun 4 16:28:11 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by bingbong on Fri May 30 18:57:27 2014. How many Americans do you employ? |
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| (1190986) | |
Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Jun 4 17:01:08 2014, in response to Re: With the higher minimum wage, restaurants are closing, posted by streetcarman1 on Fri May 30 19:06:05 2014. He can't. He thinks that human contact will turn him into a liberal. |
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