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| R44 / R46 Question (846641) | |
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| (846652) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by xtimx on Wed Oct 21 20:06:13 2009, in response to R44 / R46 Question, posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 19:51:11 2009. you answered your own question. its a rust resistant paint over the blue stripe. |
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| (846661) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 20:38:55 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by xtimx on Wed Oct 21 20:06:13 2009. Ahhh, thanks :) It is sad they had to do that the R44's & R46's looked better with the blue stripe |
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Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Hank Eisenstein on Wed Oct 21 20:48:35 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 20:38:55 2009. Nothing looked good with that stripe.The R44 has a steel band there, where the R46 is all stainless steel. |
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Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Newkirk Images on Wed Oct 21 20:49:25 2009, in response to R44 / R46 Question, posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 19:51:11 2009. I am curious about how come the R44 has a grey stripe versus stainless steel like the R46, plus how come they took off the blue stripes?Because the metal band on the R-44 is carbon steel where as on the R-46 it is stainless steel. It may have been decided that enamel paint would adhere better to a steel surface than a stainless steel surface. I believe there is a special primer needed for paint to adhere to stainless steel as well as galvanized steel. Ever see peeling paint on those galvanized steel windscreens on the "el" platforms ? Surfaces were not primed, just painted. The decision to not return blue stripes to rolling stock after GOH probably centered on making a full stainless steel fleet with no body paint to maintain. Bill Newkirk |
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Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 20:55:18 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Hank Eisenstein on Wed Oct 21 20:48:35 2009. Well, IMHO it looked good to me. |
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Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 20:56:29 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Newkirk Images on Wed Oct 21 20:49:25 2009. Ahhh, ok thanks :) I still say the blue was better :) |
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| (846677) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 21 20:58:11 2009, in response to R44 / R46 Question, posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 19:51:11 2009. The R-44 was built with a carbon steel strip across the midsection. The R-46 was built without that. The carbon steel strip is now painted gray. It's not blue for the same reason none of the other cars that had blue strips have them any longer, I'd guess. |
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| (846685) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by R42 4787 on Wed Oct 21 21:28:37 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Newkirk Images on Wed Oct 21 20:49:25 2009. LIRR did the same with the M-1s in the mid 1980s. The blue exterior striping was removed to save painting costs. |
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| (846688) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 21:36:28 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 21 20:58:11 2009. Ok thanks :) Appreciate it. |
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| (846692) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by xtimx on Wed Oct 21 21:42:21 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 20:38:55 2009. i agree that it looked better with the stripe. |
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| (846693) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Oct 21 21:44:02 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by R42 4787 on Wed Oct 21 21:28:37 2009. From what I have heard, that is not entirely the case. I was told that Metro North has an OSHA compliant paint shop whereas the LIRR does not so M-N continued with the blue stripe after the LIRR stopped painting them. As for the NYCT, the principal reason that the blue stripes were removed from all cats that had them was due to the graffiti problem that still existed into the 1980s when the GOHing was started. The SIR R-44s had the carbon steel area replaced by stainless steel on its R-44s and 4 NYCT R-44s had the same thing done. The NYCT found it too costly to do the entire R-44 fleet as it done with the SIR fleet and opted to cheap out on the remainder of the R-44s and paint the blue band area with something closely resembling a stainless steel color. It still looks like s--t. |
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| (846701) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 22:10:44 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by randyo on Wed Oct 21 21:44:02 2009. Thank you I miss the blue stripe |
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Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by INDependent on Wed Oct 21 22:55:26 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by randyo on Wed Oct 21 21:44:02 2009. I kind of like the grey on grey look of the silver stripe! |
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| (846717) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Oct 21 22:58:53 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by xtimx on Wed Oct 21 21:42:21 2009. If they save an R46 and or an R44 set[s], I do hope they paint the sides blue. |
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| (846815) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by joe c on Thu Oct 22 09:26:01 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by randyo on Wed Oct 21 21:44:02 2009. The 2 NYCT R44 cars that i know of with the stainless steel band are 5228 and 5229.til next time |
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| (846826) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by SUBWAYSURF on Thu Oct 22 09:58:10 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by arnine on Wed Oct 21 22:10:44 2009. The R44s and R46s looked best before they removed the blue stripe, it's "racoon mask" and all those extra gauardlights:
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| (846828) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Waynejay on Thu Oct 22 10:00:50 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Grand Concourse on Wed Oct 21 22:58:53 2009. Agreed! I think the blue stipe was a nice touch. |
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| (846855) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by arnine on Thu Oct 22 11:12:35 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by SUBWAYSURF on Thu Oct 22 09:58:10 2009. Yup I agree it did they should have left it alone. |
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| (846991) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Thu Oct 22 18:55:30 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by R42 4787 on Wed Oct 21 21:28:37 2009. The R-44 and R-46 had the blue stripes. When the R-44 and R-46 had the GOH, the stripes were removed. If you look at an R-44 on the A it appears that there is a light gray painted band where the blue stripe was but the R-46 is all stainless steel with no hint of the blue stripe. To complicate matters, if you look at a SIRT R-44, it is identical to the R-46 and not the R-44's on the A line. I would like to know why? |
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| (846995) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Newkirk Images on Thu Oct 22 19:11:01 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Waynejay on Thu Oct 22 10:00:50 2009. Agreed! I think the blue stipe was a nice touch.Proff! 
>Line: BMT Sea Beach Line...Location: 20th Avenue... Car: R46 (Pullman-Standard, 1974-75) 506 Photo by: Doug Grotjahn...Collection of: Joe Testagrose...Date: 11/28/1975 Bill Newkirk |
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| (846997) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Thu Oct 22 19:16:54 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Newkirk Images on Thu Oct 22 19:11:01 2009. Yes!Now take a ride to 20th Avenue on the N today. The station walls are clean but the walls above the station and the adjacent white building is covered with graffiti! I hate to admit it but graffiti is worse today than it was in 1975. These surfaces need to be included in the zero tolerance anti-graffiti program implimented by David Gunn in 1984 |
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| (847044) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Thu Oct 22 21:24:42 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by randyo on Wed Oct 21 21:44:02 2009. I agree. They should have continued to paint the R44's carbon steel area blue. If they have to paint it anyway, why not paint it blue? |
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| (847046) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Thu Oct 22 21:26:56 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by R42 4787 on Wed Oct 21 21:28:37 2009. The R44s and 46s looked so much better with the blue striping and the black trim around the bulkhead windows. |
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| (847048) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Train Dude on Thu Oct 22 21:28:29 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Thu Oct 22 21:24:42 2009. because at the time, the MTA was seeking uniformity rather than creativity |
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| (847052) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Thu Oct 22 21:34:35 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Train Dude on Thu Oct 22 21:28:29 2009. What about the Redbirds, then? |
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| (847055) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Train Dude on Thu Oct 22 21:36:59 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Thu Oct 22 21:34:35 2009. What about them? They were not stainless so your comparrison is moot. The R-62s and R-68s are a far more reasonable comparrison. |
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| (847056) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by R42 4787 on Thu Oct 22 21:37:56 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Thu Oct 22 21:34:35 2009. The red was a uniform color in the late 1980s for all rebuilt LAHT cars (R26/28/29/30/33/36), as well as some R17s and R27s. |
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| (847060) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Thu Oct 22 21:50:08 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Train Dude on Thu Oct 22 21:36:59 2009. The R44's beltline, like the Redbirds, is not stainless steel and has to be painted, like the Redbirds had to. The R62s and R68s do have a stainless steel beltline, so that's actually a more reasonable comparison to the R46, not the 44. My comparison is not moot and it's not about creativity if the R44 has a blue beltline. |
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| (847064) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Train Dude on Thu Oct 22 21:53:08 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Thu Oct 22 21:50:08 2009. Have it your way |
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| (847102) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Thu Oct 22 23:25:26 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by rbseabeach on Thu Oct 22 19:16:54 2009. Somebody by the name of "MADR" has done a legion of dirty work all up and down the Sea Beach line. And methinks he has a crew along with him. He (and his crew) has made quite a mess.-w- |
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| (847306) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by randyo on Fri Oct 23 13:21:36 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by rbseabeach on Thu Oct 22 18:55:30 2009. I think that the SIR's R-44s were done first and by the time the MTA got to NYCT's R-44's the agency found that it would be too expensive to replace the band areas of the remaining R-44s with stainless steel so it opted for aluminum paint instead. |
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| (847307) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by randyo on Fri Oct 23 13:22:47 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Thu Oct 22 21:26:56 2009. The blue striping was OK, but I personally don't like the black trim around the bulkhead windows any more than I like it on the NTTs. |
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| (847309) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Oct 23 13:30:19 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by Newkirk Images on Thu Oct 22 19:11:01 2009. I agree, but it was a pointless thing which would need maintenance. Besides, the blue strip era is not one of fond memory for the system. I personally think the silver/blue paint scheme for the LAHT steel cars (except for cars older than the R15) was the best ever, but it still evokes memories of grafitti, decline and decay. |
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| (847310) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Oct 23 13:31:16 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by rbseabeach on Thu Oct 22 19:16:54 2009. Sea Beach line infrastructure in general is deplorable. Nice new cars, crumbling stations. |
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| (847356) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Fri Oct 23 15:40:33 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by randyo on Fri Oct 23 13:21:36 2009. Thank you! Than makes sense. I did like the r-44 & r-46 in the original condition. The R-44 was the first new train I experienced. I was 12 when I saw one pulling into 4th Ave on the F line. It was some sight. ALso the SIRT R-44's have had the side roll signs removed and a functional window has been installed in its place. |
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| (847373) | |
Re: R44 / R46 Question |
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Posted by Hank Eisenstein on Fri Oct 23 16:53:29 2009, in response to Re: R44 / R46 Question, posted by randyo on Fri Oct 23 13:21:36 2009. SI's R44s were overhauled entirely (and poorly) at 207th and CI. The majority of the rest of the fleet was sent out. |
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