Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator (1369559) | |
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(1370778) | |
Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 16:17:31 2015, in response to Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Wakefield-241st Street on Mon Oct 12 21:02:52 2015. Although you are technically correct, that legally the MTA could not have directed passengers with disabilities to use the PATH elevator as I asserted, you fail to see the big picture.The article was about the need for better MTA Customer Service which I am sure you would agree with from your many posts on the subject. Here is the pertinent text from the article: "Passengers with disabilities are directed to use the elevator instead at 42nd Street, eight blocks away, or the 34th Street elevator at Seventh Avenue, which serves other subway lines. What the service notice omits is that there is another elevator a short 200 feet away at 33rd Street that passengers could use instead during the outage and which serves all the same subway lines." So let's ask who uses and needs MTA elevators? Persons in wheelchairs are most certainly a small minority of those who use elevators although the elevators were installed primarily for their use. From my experience, persons with baby strollers or suitcases and those having difficulty walking are the most prevalent users. Persons in manual wheelchairs would have difficulty using the ramp without assistance. However, many have motorized wheelchairs and could use the ramp. All those customers would benefit from knowing about the PATH elevator. The fact that the passageway is is not open 24 hours is also a minor point when you consider the percentage of passengers who would need to use it during those hours as compared to the rest of the day when it is open. So the percentage of those passengers who rely on the elevator that is being repaired who could benefit from knowing about the PATH elevator is quite high. So in conclusion, although the MTA may have legally been required to direct disabled passengers to the 42 Street elevator or the one on 7th Avenue as they did, mentioning the PATH elevator on the service notice would have helped most of the users who used the elevtor before it was closed for repairs and would have been a big service to their customers. (They also could have mentioned the hours when the passageway is shut to avoid passengers using the elevator and then having to return to the street to use MTA services.) But the MTA is not that interested in providing good customer service so they don't and that was the major point of the article and is still a valid point. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 16:19:38 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by fdtutf on Mon Oct 26 16:15:48 2015. That is me, but when I click on the link where I supposedly said that, I am directed to the last article I wrote not to that comment. |
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(1370788) | |
Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by R30A on Mon Oct 26 17:13:35 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 16:19:38 2015. "Allan Rosen: After five years, I was fired from Shwepsheadbites. This was my last article for them. Guess I stepped in too many toes. The city doesn't want its citizens to know the truth, only the lies they spread."Is what I see... |
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(1370794) | |
Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Dyre Dan on Mon Oct 26 18:58:26 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 16:17:31 2015. Aren't PATH elevators signed as being ONLY for used by the handicapped? I know the one in Hoboken is, I'm not positive about the one at Herald Square, but I suspect that that is PATH policy throughout their system. How much that restriction is observed or enforced, I don't know. But if it is officially in place, it wouldn't really do for the MTA to officially recommend violating it. |
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(1370795) | |
Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Dyre Dan on Mon Oct 26 19:07:38 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by R30A on Mon Oct 26 17:13:35 2015. Where do you see it? The link to Facebook shows a box with the following text and a photograph:
Clicking on that links to a September 1 column at Sheepshead Bites, which concludes with the following notes:
I don't see the statement about being fired. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 19:12:29 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Dyre Dan on Mon Oct 26 18:58:26 2015. I didn't see such a sign at 34 St. If it does exist, it would be a pretty ridiculous policy. I wonder what their definition of "handicapped" would be if it is true. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 19:13:39 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Dyre Dan on Mon Oct 26 19:07:38 2015. Neither did I. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by WillD on Mon Oct 26 19:19:25 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Dyre Dan on Mon Oct 26 19:07:38 2015. Click where it says "1 like, 1 comment". At least that's what it says at the moment, it could conceivably change. Facebook will then show you Mr Koppelman liked the post and display Mr. Rosen's comments. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Joe V on Mon Oct 26 19:31:05 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 19:12:29 2015. ADA regs say everyone must be given equal access, no disrimination, so we get federal requirements such as full length/level boarding platforms. But that has to be a 2-way street. However, I would not put it past PATH to make more borderline illegal rules such as that, as they have photography bans. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 19:31:15 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by WillD on Mon Oct 26 19:19:25 2015. That was said in jest. You really cannot be fired from a job that doesn't pay you anything. The official reason I was given was that they decided they were not going to run any more "opinion" columns and were going to solely concentrate on "hard news". I am really seeing a lot of "hard news" there now. At least my columns got people to think and comment. They can barely get ten people now to comment on their "hard news." Most columns have zero comments. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by WillD on Mon Oct 26 19:32:58 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 16:17:31 2015. If they'd directed passengers to the PATH elevator you'd be sure to share with us the tale of woe from some misbegotten poor non-ambulatory passenger who gets off the Q at 3AM and has no way of reaching the street. Or someone in a manual wheelchair "tricked" by the MTA into slogging up the ramp to the PATH elevator.It's a heads I win, tails you lose game for the anti-transit automobile advocate. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by WillD on Mon Oct 26 19:42:22 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 19:31:15 2015. That was said in jest.But you said you did not post the comment. Which is it? You really cannot be fired from a job that doesn't pay you anything. You most certainly can. They can barely get ten people now to comment on their "hard news." Halle-fucking-lujah. Maybe sanity is finally breaking out all over. I wish them much luck fighting the cancer that is the comment portion of a news website's content. But at the very least it put an end to one particularly uninformed and insipid source of misinformation, so that's a plus. Most columns have zero comments. Determining the value of website content by comment count is about as moronic as determining the value of a city by the speed and volume of automobile traffic. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Oct 26 21:14:05 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 19:31:15 2015. This has got to be one of the most bizarre subthreads/exchanges in SubChat's illustrious history. In the parlance of our times, "I'm done." Except that I'm not. I'm going to get maximum play out of this. Un-freaking-believable. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Oct 26 21:14:49 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 15:38:05 2015. What is wrong with you? |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by priya12 on Tue Oct 27 00:37:20 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Oct 26 21:14:49 2015. Still having mailroom withdrawal? |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 07:30:26 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by priya12 on Tue Oct 27 00:37:20 2015. No? My dire and chronic unemployment situation is none of your business.Let him answer the question. What is wrong with him? |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 09:57:49 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by WillD on Mon Oct 26 19:32:58 2015. Untrue. If the MTA signage were adequate and clear, the responsibility for mistakes is on the passenger, not the operator. Remember, I worked for the MTA. So I am capable of seeing the picture from both sides, not only the passengers's. And as for your claim I am anti-transit, that is pure BS as the record clearly shows. As far as being an automobile advocate, I would describe is as a fairness advocate where everyone s treated equally, not where you only consider te bus riders needs and ignore everyone else's and your goal is to slow automobile travel to punish the who dare to drive when te mass transit system is inadequate expecting people to tolerate rush hour conditions at 11PM at night or wait one hour four a bus during the day because you are improperly managing the bus system, and when you clearly are violating your own passenger service guidelines. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by mcorivervsaf on Tue Oct 27 10:07:03 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 07:30:26 2015. No? My dire and chronic unemployment situation is none of your business.You made it known to everyone when you posted this, Brian Weinberg. OOPS! |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by fdtutf on Tue Oct 27 10:23:00 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Terrapin Station on Mon Oct 26 21:14:05 2015. LOL x 1,000. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by fdtutf on Tue Oct 27 10:54:40 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 09:57:49 2015. And as for your claim I am anti-transit, that is pure BS as the record clearly shows.Where would this "record" be? It certainly isn't your columns at Sheepshead Bites, where you have consistently defended the privileges of motorists against all threatened encroachment by users of other modes. As far as being an automobile advocate, I would describe is as a fairness advocate where everyone s treated equally, (as long as they're in a car,) not where you only consider te bus riders needs and ignore everyone else's and your goal is to slow automobile travel to punish the who dare to drive when te mass transit system is inadequate expecting people to tolerate rush hour conditions at 11PM at night or wait one hour four a bus during the day because you are improperly managing the bus system, and when you clearly are violating your own passenger service guidelines. Kudos. That sentence is positively Faulknerian. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Tue Oct 27 12:39:03 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by mcorivervsaf on Tue Oct 27 10:07:03 2015. Did I do that? LOL. As obviously implied by the linked post, I was merely restating what had already been posted. So no, I did not make it known to everyone then. It was already known at that time. Please learn how to read and comprehend. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Tue Oct 27 12:40:24 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by fdtutf on Tue Oct 27 10:23:00 2015. :) |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Wakefield-241st Street on Tue Oct 27 13:08:06 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Oct 26 16:17:31 2015. We are both be in agreement as to how the MTA ignores their own mistakes.However, the point was - - you should have visually observed the two issues regarding ADA accessibility from the PATH elevator to the full time fare control area at the west side of 34th Street and Broadway/6th Ave (technically it's 34th and Broadway on the West side). I was taking an impartial approach to see if you or NYCT was correct regarding the information for the 34th Street elevator closure. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by mcorivervsaf on Tue Oct 27 13:37:07 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by terRAPIN station on Tue Oct 27 12:39:03 2015. That's right, avoid the issue! Don't own up to it, just dance around it!Dance, Brian, dance! |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Tue Oct 27 13:49:23 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by mcorivervsaf on Tue Oct 27 13:37:07 2015. Avoid what issue? Own up to what? Dance around what? What in the world are you talking about? |
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Posted by mcorivervsaf on Tue Oct 27 14:00:46 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by terRAPIN station on Tue Oct 27 13:49:23 2015. Oh, so now you're pretending that you don't know, all of a sudden? LOL!BTW, You're still a hypocrite. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 14:15:40 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 07:30:26 2015. There is nothing wrong with me other than I forgot I posted that on Facebook. I meant to send a private message but was in a hurry so I made a mistake. Something you obviously never do. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 14:26:13 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by WillD on Mon Oct 26 19:42:22 2015. I replied to Terrapin here that I was mistaken.http://www.subchat.com/read.asp?Id=1370945 And you cannot be fired from a job that has no pay. You can only be asked not to continue volunteering your services which is what I was doing. As far as the value of my column, I have received many favorable comments and requests for me to start my own blog. If you found it insipid and uninformed, no one was forcing you to read it. If you hate Fox News or the NY Times because you don't like their reporting, you woud seek out other sources, not continue reading those and constantly expressing your displeasure to the editor and others. That's what an intelligent and sensible person would do. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 14:27:31 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by The silence on Tue Oct 13 00:53:48 2015. Neither can they guarantee their own elevators are working either. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 14:34:47 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Wakefield-241st Street on Tue Oct 27 13:08:06 2015. As I stated, the legality of the sign posted is only one factor. You were correct on that one. But why should the MTA only follow the letter of the law? Shouldn't they go one step further to show they care about their customers by informing riders about that elevator? That was the issue I was writing about and the "elevator" was actually a very small portion of the article.And when I say that, I am speaking about the MTA as an agency. I know and am sure there are many employees who care a lot about their customers. I was one of them for nearly 25 years. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by priya12 on Tue Oct 27 14:47:52 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 07:30:26 2015. Why do you think you are chronically unemployed? I'd bet its a behavior problem! |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Oct 27 15:04:32 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by priya12 on Tue Oct 27 14:47:52 2015. If you believe the 🐢 Turtle is actually unemployed, I've got a lovely suspension bridge 🌉 to sell you. Very inspiring view of Brooklyn. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 19:10:05 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 14:15:40 2015. Even if true, you should have recognized the text as exactly word for word from what you thought you sent as a private message! Instead you expressed complete denial of the whole thing!! |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 19:15:17 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 14:26:13 2015. You are incorrect. You certainly can be fired from a job with no pay. Being fired is a forced ending of the relationship. If you were only asked to leave, you could refuse. If you can not refuse, then you were fired. Thus, you were fired, as you yourself stated in your Facebook comment. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 19:15:59 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 14:27:31 2015. But they can report the status of their own elevators. |
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(1370997) | |
Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 19:24:08 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by priya12 on Tue Oct 27 14:47:52 2015. Why are you asking me? I'm not the one who originally said I'm unemployed. I'm just repeating what has been stated here for years by others. LOL @ you thinking that someone would brag about their unemployment. Maybe you have an intelligence issue? |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 19:24:36 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Oct 27 15:04:32 2015. Ssshhhhh, don't ruin it! |
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(1371014) | |
Posted by mcorivervsaf on Tue Oct 27 20:50:54 2015, in response to Re: Subject goes here, posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 19:06:42 2015. Uh-huh. Keep telling yourself that.Your reputation on here speaks for itself. Don't play dumb. Hypocrite. |
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(1371027) | |
Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 23:19:47 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 19:10:05 2015. I did recognize the text which I also used in private e-mails. As I stated, I had no recollection of posting it on Facebook. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 23:43:09 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by fdtutf on Tue Oct 27 10:54:40 2015. That record would be responsible for the largest bus service improvement in Brooklyn. Eleven routes changed on the same day in 1978. Those changes never would have happened if not for me. Additionally many more of the changes I made in 1978 came to fruition years later when the MTA finally realized they should be done. Among them were the B82 extension from Canal Av to Coney Island. (it was the B5 when I recommended it.); the extension of the S53 from 95 St to 86 St. (It was the R7 when I proposed it.); extension of the B68 from West 5th to Stillwell and rerouting the B1 from Bay Ridge Avenue to 86 Street.Also, in my 1972 Masters Thesis I proposed extending the B38 in Ridgewood, the route they called the B43, the route they called the B47, extending the B57 to replace the B75 and the east west portion of te B61 along 9 Street to replace the B77. I thought of all those changes as long as 38 years before the MTA made them. And as I proved to you before at least half of my Sheepsheadbtes articles related to bus improvements and less than 25% even mentioned automobiles, but you insist on distorting the facts. And when I say fairness for everyone, I do indeed mean everyone. Your definition of everyone is bus riders, cyclists and pedestrians? Why do you not consider the needs of automobile drivers? I will tell you. It is because of our anti-automobile bias where you believe no one should drive and we need to make driving as inconvenient as possible to discourage auto use and promote mass transit even if we make no mass transit improvements. I woudn't call that being fair to everyone, but you would. And as for that last sentence, it is a run on, but is perfectly understandable. You just can't accept any viewpoints that don't agree with yours. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by WillD on Wed Oct 28 00:27:41 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 19:24:36 2015. Really, it's a good shibboleth for figuring out which handles are legitimate newbie posters and which are sockpuppets for posters who've been here a while. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 28 00:54:48 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by WillD on Wed Oct 28 00:27:41 2015. No more calls, please. We have a winner! :) |
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(1371047) | |
Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 28 07:20:28 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 23:19:47 2015. But that's not relevant to us! What's relevant is that we were able to find and replicate the exact text of what you thought you sent via a private message. So you should not have been denying anything! |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 28 07:21:15 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by WillD on Wed Oct 28 00:27:41 2015. Heh, yep. |
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(1371049) | |
Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 28 07:21:46 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Oct 27 19:15:17 2015. Bump. |
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(1371051) | |
Re: Subject goes here |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 28 07:28:13 2015, in response to , posted by mcorivervsaf on Tue Oct 27 20:50:54 2015. Not a hypocrite. You must be mistaken. |
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Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 28 07:32:28 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Oct 27 23:43:09 2015. How come far more people disagree with you then agree with you, aspect the comments in your blog posts and SubChat.com posts? |
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Posted by mcorivervsaf on Wed Oct 28 09:53:06 2015, in response to Re: Subject goes here, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 28 07:28:13 2015. Nope. You're dancing around the truth, as usual. |
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(1371080) | |
Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator |
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Posted by fdtutf on Wed Oct 28 10:11:25 2015, in response to Re: Allan Rosen and the 34th Street (Herald Square) elevator, posted by WillD on Wed Oct 28 00:27:41 2015. Wait, there's sockpuppetry here?!?!? |
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