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| Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service (105109) | |
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| (105883) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Wed Jul 9 23:00:18 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 13:38:59 2008. 1. Take a video camera or a suitable device that captures video and sound. Also a bullhorn.2. Go to the Eltingville Transit Center around morning rush hour. 3. Begin recording. 4. Take said bullhorn and shout "THE CITY WOULD BE BETTER OFF WITHOUT THE EXPRESS BUSES DRAINING THE FUNDS!" 5. Record results. 6. Post here. |
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| (105884) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:03:38 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Jul 9 22:58:26 2008. I missed the part where I asked for your opinion. |
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| (105886) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:21:08 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Jul 9 22:58:26 2008. Actually...they don't completely, at least not at this time. |
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| (105887) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:21:10 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Hank Eisenstein on Wed Jul 9 14:19:55 2008. Perhaps because their rides are subsidized less then 1 dollar per rider as opposed to over 10 dollars per rider. |
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| (105888) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:27:41 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:21:08 2008. Specifically, what I am saying is that the subway will need something along the lines of a brand new trunk, including one to SI connecting to the existing SIR (along with a relocation of the big bus terminal in SI to Edgewater, where a terminal could go), sooner than you think.What would be done is that after the SI Expressway, SIR would descend to a new station by Edgewater, which would be deep-bored. The subway would remain deep-bored until it reaches Red Hook, with a station near the Gowanus, and then another one somewhere in Carroll Gardens before veering westward to connect with either the Broadway line or SAS. |
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| (105889) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:28:41 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:03:38 2008. How is that relevant? The problem with your statement is you are arguing one point without stating what a solution may be...in short, dismissing it out of hand. OTOH, I'm offering what should be done as a solution. |
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| (105890) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:30:05 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:27:41 2008. It could probably be constructed relatively cheaply through brooklyn if done in conjunction with the sinking of the gowanus. |
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| (105892) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:36:53 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:28:41 2008. Lincoln keeps blindly stating that all express buses should be eliminated. I have offered compromises but with him it's all or nothing. I admit that you don't need the BxM6 outside of rush hour. QM4 service isn't needed on weekends. However, express buses serve parts of the city not adequately served by the subway. Also, there are people who are simply fed up with the subway. Considering how overcrowded, slow, and filthy it is, I don't blame them. It's better that they use the express bus than to use their own private vehicles. |
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| (105895) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:40:31 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:36:53 2008. The people who live in areas not served by subway should deal with the fact that their area is not served by subway. Subsidizing lines in excess of 10$ per rider is absurd. |
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| (105896) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:40:45 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:36:53 2008. However...with the exception of Staten Island, which the MTA has until recently seen as the backwater, there is an existing subway alternative.With respect to SI, the best solution may require going through New Jersey, or abutting Red Hook as part of SAS. The problem with your posts: You don't come up with solutions. |
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| (105898) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Grand concourse on Wed Jul 9 23:43:53 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:40:45 2008. I still say they should have all their routes meet up in one central location [basically turning SI into shuttle routes] and then have specific buses going to either midtown or lower manhattan. Whether it goes thru NJ or the BQE, is up to the MTA. |
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| (105899) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Wed Jul 9 23:45:23 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:40:31 2008. "The people who live in areas not served by subway should deal with the fact that their area is not served by subway.And so they drive, local buses get stuck in traffic, EVERYBODY WINS! |
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| (105901) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:45:51 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Grand concourse on Wed Jul 9 23:43:53 2008. They should meet up at one location-- St George!Take the boat from there! |
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| (105902) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:48:32 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Kriston Lewis on Wed Jul 9 23:45:23 2008. "They" would likely not drive for the most part.A large portion of "Them" would take the subway. Even if ALL of "Them" drove instead, The increase in drivers would be fairly minimal! The money going to "Their" Paratransit System for the Enabled would be able to benefit in excess of 10X the amounts of people if it went to the subway! |
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| (105904) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:50:19 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:40:45 2008. There are some days when I don't feel like taking the subway. |
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| (105905) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:51:46 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:50:19 2008. That doesnt mean OTHER PEOPLE SHOULD HAVE TO PAY FOR YOUR DESIRES. |
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| (105906) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:52:22 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:40:31 2008. Subsidizing lines in excess of 10$ per rider is absurd.That is an unsubstantiated figure. But besides that, I'm subsidizing a 7 train extension that won't benefit me in any way, shape, or form (same as the SAS and R160's that don't appear on any line I use). |
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| (105908) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:53:19 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:40:31 2008. Subsidizing lines in excess of 10$ per rider is absurd.That is an unsubstantiated figure. But besides that, I'm subsidizing a 7 train extension that won't benefit me in any way, shape, or form (same as the SAS and R160's that don't appear on any line I use). |
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| (105909) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:54:57 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:52:22 2008. You are right, it is totally unsubstantiated because it is wrong. The MTA claimed something between 11 and 12, and with the diesel it is probably near or above 15 a rider, but I decided to be conservative with my estimate. |
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| (105911) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:56:00 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:53:19 2008. Well, no you arent. Those arent funded by fares, and your express bus fare goes nowhere except to pay for a small fraction of your express bus ride. |
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| (105912) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:57:06 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:53:19 2008. Actually, if the results are similar to what the NYCDOT found for former private line expresses, it isn't far off...considering service levels.The first move I would make, however, is to cut express bus service by 10% during the peak---and then to every 2 hours off-peak (except for the X1, X10, and X17, which would go to 30 minutes during the day). For instance, the BxM7 schedule during the end of the rush hour would look like: 8:15 AM, 8:30 AM, 9 AM, 11 AM, 1 PM, 3 PM, 5 PM...etc. |
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| (105913) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Wed Jul 9 23:58:08 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 22:28:13 2008. The M4 south of 110th Street/5th Avenue = Redundant, and the M103 isn't the most reliable route. |
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| (105914) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Thu Jul 10 00:00:01 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:57:06 2008. The first move I would make, however, is to cut express bus service by 10% during the peakNo and then to every 2 hours off-peak (except for the X1, X10, and X17, which would go to 30 minutes during the day). I can deal with that |
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| (105915) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:01:47 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Thu Jul 10 00:00:01 2008. Most buses do not run nearly full...and it would be an adjustment to meet loading guidelines.And all the while, local bus riders, especially on Union Turnpike, are flagged by buses because the service there is inadequate...and there is no room to house local buses at QV. |
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| (105916) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 10 00:02:14 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Grand concourse on Wed Jul 9 23:43:53 2008. At least send them to Brooklyn to 36th Street station. |
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| (105917) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Thu Jul 10 00:03:37 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:57:06 2008. Nah.The proper way to run the express buses is to make the average fare paid cover each rider to the extent that the system only has to subsidize each rider to the same amount as the subway gets subsidized per rider. When they actually have to pay for their rides, I doubt there would be any ridership left on the expresses, but if there is still ridership, then I would have no problem with keeping them. Mind you, I suspect the base fare would be at around $20 per trip, so people would have to be loaded to ride them with any regularity. |
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| (105918) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 10 00:03:49 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:48:32 2008. A large portion of "Them" would take the subway.I thought that they mainly use them to avoid the subway, which I agree with because of routes like the BxM11 and BxM6. |
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| (105919) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 10 00:05:31 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Wed Jul 9 23:57:06 2008. I really wanna see the results of 2 hour headways on the QM1/A and BxM7. |
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| (105920) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:06:22 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 10 00:03:49 2008. Unless you are unable to---or traveling with someone who is unable to---use stairs, that shouldn't be a problem.*NOTE: I sometimes do travel with someone who is unable to climb subway stairs, and thus have to use the X-bus. |
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| (105922) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Thu Jul 10 00:07:09 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Thu Jul 10 00:03:37 2008. I suspect the base fare would be at around $20 per trip,Which is a completely arbitrary and baseless figure. Fuel is expensive, but it's not THAT expensive. I can't comprehend how it costs $10+ per passenger on an express bus that travels 10 miles (especially when it costs less for an equivalent ride on a commuter railroad). |
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| (105923) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:07:38 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:48:32 2008. Then why is the MTA doing the exact opposite of your idea, especially with MTA Bus, where X-bus service has been upped on many lines? |
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| (105924) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:09:13 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Thu Jul 10 00:03:37 2008. However...what about those who cannot use the subway mostly for reasons of being UNABLE to climb stairs...but who are not eligible for paratransit? (Off this board, I have described an example.) |
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| (105925) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Thu Jul 10 00:09:27 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:07:38 2008. Because the MTA looks beyond a few esoteric statistics. They see the positive impact of express bus service. |
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| (105926) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Thu Jul 10 00:09:43 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Thu Jul 10 00:07:09 2008. It costs much less on commuter railroads because...1. They are MUCH more fuel efficient 2. They generally have MUCH more turnover 3. They generally have MUCH higher capacity 4. They generally have MUCH higher usage And when you consider all of that, commuter rail isnt that efficient... |
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| (105927) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:10:15 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:30:05 2008. But why spend money on sinking the Gowanus that can be better spent elsewhere? |
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| (105928) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Thu Jul 10 00:10:49 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:09:13 2008. Obviously you...A Short term-- Fix paratransit so that those who need it can use it B Long term-- Make subways accessable. |
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| (105929) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 10 00:12:04 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:06:22 2008. I once met a lady who takes the BxM11 because she is afraid to take the subway. |
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| (105930) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:12:21 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:21:10 2008. However...do you have the figures stating that their ride is being subsidized THAT MUCH? I would be surprised if it was more than 5-6. |
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| (105931) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Thu Jul 10 00:12:56 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 10 00:12:04 2008. Thank you. But of course, a few random statistics won't represent scenarios like this. |
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| (105932) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:14:03 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Thu Jul 10 00:09:27 2008. Leonard...I'm sorry, but that particular one was specifically for Lincoln. |
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Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Thu Jul 10 00:14:08 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 10 00:12:04 2008. Too bad for her.WHY THE HELL SHOULD WE BE SUBSIDIZING PEOPLES IRRATIONAL FEARS? |
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| (105934) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:14:58 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 10 00:12:04 2008. But is this woman physically disabled? (The issue with this person I know is a physical disability.) |
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| (105935) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:19:02 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:52:22 2008. But will it benefit the city as a whole?OTOH, for Yankee Stadium's station, that station would only benefit the Yankees if it is used only during game days...and it wouldn't hurt the city nearly as much, as the city has to fill those parking spaces in the garages that it---and not the Yankees---will control. |
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| (105936) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:20:09 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:54:57 2008. However Linc---on the flip side, why has the MTA been increasing X-bus service?BTW, the MTA's fuel prices are locked in through 2009. |
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| (105937) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Thu Jul 10 00:20:27 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Wed Jul 9 23:48:32 2008. There's a subway on Hylan Boulevard? Where? I'll take it. |
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| (105938) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by R30A on Thu Jul 10 00:20:54 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Kriston Lewis on Thu Jul 10 00:20:27 2008. Staten Island Ferry. |
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| (105939) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:21:15 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 10 00:05:31 2008. The QBx1 may see increased ridership, for one...and the Section 5 shuttle may be made an all-weekday service. |
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| (105940) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Thu Jul 10 00:22:26 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by Forest Glen on Wed Jul 9 23:52:22 2008. "I'm subsidizing a 7 train extension that won't benefit me in any way..."And I (well my parents) have to subsidize the  train which does not benefit us or anyone else on Fulton Street for that matter. That's how this country works.
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| (105941) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:22:35 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Thu Jul 10 00:09:43 2008. However...that is what Staten Island has been wanting...a rail link out of the island...but it has fallen on deaf ears. |
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| (105942) | |
Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Thu Jul 10 00:23:48 2008, in response to Re: Staten Islanders unsatisfied with MTA bus service, posted by R30A on Thu Jul 10 00:20:54 2008. Staten Islanders want an actual rail link; but that has fallen on deaf ears. |
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