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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 12:46:38 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 12:40:02 2010. Ok I can see that thanks :) |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 12:46:39 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:40:26 2010. Losing his leg is NOT a punishment or price for a crime.He lost his leg because he was stupid and careless. The punishment for the crime is a fine and an appearance in court. ROAR |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Mon Feb 15 12:47:05 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:40:26 2010. limb amputation is too high a price to pay for his crime,True. But I feel bad for the parents. They are probably a couple of hard working, middle-class jabronis whose lives have been turned upside down by this. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:50:32 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by 9 local on Mon Feb 15 12:25:57 2010. I agree that probation is an acceptable response from the justice system.The State of New York didn't take his leg: an R160 did. That is a contradiction. The R160 is the property of the State of New York. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 12:53:11 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:40:26 2010. No I do feel bad that he lost his legs as he was doing something stupid and something many can say is kid hijinks and is going to affect him for life and way beyond whatever punishment he gets. But, I don't think it should be a substitute for punishment given by the state who did not punish him by taking his leg he did that. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:53:13 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 12:46:10 2010. Depending on the circumstance, they shouldn't always be punished either. A court should weigh injuries in their decision as to what sentence to hand down. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:53:59 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 12:42:31 2010. Depriving what? I bolded the relevant portion. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 12:55:21 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:50:32 2010. The R-160 did not do anything!NYCT, the City of NY, and NY State have NO RESPONSIBILITY whatsoever for injuries received by trespassers. They have made every effort to prevent trespassing and criminal activity. I am sorry that hew was hurt, I feel for his family, but he is not quite done yet. He still has to go to court over his crimes. You know, I know many who have been charged with Vehicular Homicide when their best friends died in a car that they were driving. It is a trial for everybody involved, but he still had to go to court, and receive his sentence. It did not include jail time, but his life has been twisted just as badly. ROAR |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 12:59:57 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:53:13 2010. Injuries received in the commission of a crime do not weigh with the judgment to be passed.That said, I would expect that a judgment will not be excessive in this case or any other similar case (without an injury). Nobody is going to put him in jail, nobody is going to fine him the full cost of cleaning up his mess (although they should). Lots of better people than he live with one leg or less. For most such people it builds their character. And many already had a positive character before their injuries (think troops). He will put this behind him, and if he has any character whatsoever will pick himself up and excel with what he has. ROAR |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:00:32 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 12:55:21 2010. NYCT, the City of NY, and NY State have NO RESPONSIBILITY whatsoever for injuries received by trespassers. They have made every effort to prevent trespassing and criminal activity.That may be for the courts to decide. The R-160 did not do anything! The R-160 struck him. Something needn't be a conscious entity in order to "do" something. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 13:00:51 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:53:13 2010. Sorry I disagree. Their injuries and his injuries were obtained while they were committing a crime and should not be taken into an account. I might feel differently if let's say a cop interfered and his leg got taken in that process, but in this case it was 100% him. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by RockParkMan on Mon Feb 15 13:04:48 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Newkirk Plaza David on Mon Feb 15 10:10:12 2010. There is very little chance of a crew losing our jobs over a 12-9. Testing positive on post incident testing or talking/texting on a cell phone or not reporting a 12-9 are about the only way. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 13:05:01 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:53:59 2010. Correct. I saw that. But nobody deprived him of life, liberty or the pursuit of happiness. And nobody deprived him of his leg. He could have lost it in an automobile accident, or an industrial accident, or he could have just fallen down the stairs all on his own.He was involved in an accident. He lost his leg. Ok So what? He committed a crime, and was caught doing so. Ok, so what? The LION is not judge or jury. The perp needs to see a judge and the judge will judge. A penalty for his misfeasance will be imposed. The LION would guess that he will be given probation until the age of 21. It looks like he needs a babysitter anyway. ROAR |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:06:23 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 13:05:01 2010. Correct. I saw that. But nobody deprived him of life, liberty or the pursuit of happiness. And nobody deprived him of his leg. He could have lost it in an automobile accident, or an industrial accident, or he could have just fallen down the stairs all on his own.No, not in this case. Equal protection doesn't apply. I was referring to your proposal. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by RockParkMan on Mon Feb 15 13:10:12 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:40:26 2010. The loss of the limb doesn't equal a punishment. It might be the price he paid for his stupidity but a criminal punishment is defined by the law that was violated. A judge might take the lost leg into account though. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Newkirk Images on Mon Feb 15 13:11:29 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by RailBus63 on Mon Feb 15 10:21:48 2010. Wonderful use of the English language by the Post’s headline writer. I guess someone who is hit by an automobile would get the headline “MAN HIT BY ROAD’.This news item was a very small article in the NY Post newspaper. Condensing of title was necessary to keep the title brief. All newspapers have done and still do this. Bill Newkirk |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by joe c on Mon Feb 15 13:12:06 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 13:00:51 2010. I agree,he did it to himself.he could've made the choice of not doingit knowing full well the danger of what he was doing,but he didn't and he lost his leg for it.not only that,he's putting his family through this and the train crew.UNLESS someone told him to do it(he could've said no)he's responible for his actions. til next time |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:13:30 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by LuchAAA on Mon Feb 15 07:57:59 2010. THis is correct and it is an outrage. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 13:13:40 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:00:32 2010. No. The R-160 *did Not* strike him. The R-160 was minding its own business. It was running on a track. It could not do anything else.I have seen sheets of steel fall on a worker, and yes he was struck by the metal. He was doing whatever it was he was doing and the steel tipped over pinning him under it. The metal was standing there, and the next thing you knew it was on top of this guy. IT MOVED WHERE IT WAS NOT EXPECTED TO GO. An R-160 was doing exactly what it was expected to do. It did nothing unusual. A part did not spring out and catch this guy. It did NOTHING. NOTHING. (Sgt. Schultz) If a bus runs up on the curb and strikes someone, then yes the bus hit them, and the driver is at fault. But if someone steps in front of the bus, then the bus and it's driver is held harmless. Now if we throw you under the bus, that is a different proposition altogether. ROAR |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:15:54 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 13:13:40 2010. All of that is well and good, but "struck" does not in any way imply the object doing the striking is doing anything out of the ordinary. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:19:59 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 08:56:20 2010. The vandals squad based out of CI has a data base with thousands of taggers. Most of the time, the vandals squad know the tagger. Here is the issue, Lets use the tag JA ONE, He has been around since the 1970's. Now lets say I am a rival vandal. Now I go out and go on a bombing spree but instead of using my tag, I use JA ONE. Now if the NYPD were simply able to go to JA ONE's residence and arrest him, he would be arrested for the tags that I did as a copycat. This is a major enforcement problem. THis is why they have to be caught in the act. Another terrible loophole. Lets say JA One went out one night with three color spray cans and tagged up 25 surfaces. LEts say he used red for 23 surfaces, white for 1 and black for one. Now he was caught with the black, he could only be charged with the ONE tag!! Unless he had red residue on his hands or someother way to prove it was him. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:21:33 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 09:13:12 2010. too bsd it wasn't the hand that holds the spray can. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 13:24:04 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:06:23 2010. I proposed that persons under 33 should be caned for their misfeasance.The LION thinks that this sort of corporal punishment is neither cruel nor unusual, but that will need to be debated since it has not been done here in the past 200 years. But it is a punishment. It must be ordered by a court, and administered by a skilled practitioner. You see, most of these kids do NOT need jail time for this sort of stuff, and a fine is a rather irrelevant to them: they have no concept of money and its value. They should be caned. They will remember that, and it should altar their behaviors. It is more meaningful than a fine, and less harmful than jail time. ROAR |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Karl M, Ex New Yorker on Mon Feb 15 13:24:25 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Karl M, Ex New Yorker on Mon Feb 15 12:28:21 2010. Has anyone here typed subway art on Google search ? and see the books out there on this graffiti crap? kids like this one see and read this and they think it OK to do this and some like this kid gets hurt or killed, I'd put some of the blame of the graffiti shit on the authors who peddle these books along with YouTube who shows these videos, they should be banned like pornography period. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:24:32 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 11:20:26 2010. WHat would happen if lets say that idiot were on the roof of your building spraying and he fell and also lost a limb, he would then sue you as the owner of the building becasue you did not have razor fencing installed to prevent him from illegally gaining access to your roof to illegally tag it. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:25:17 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 11:21:28 2010. The courts would have given him a metrocard and a spray can |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:26:02 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 11:57:14 2010. agreed! |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:26:23 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 11:57:29 2010. agreed |
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Posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 13:27:46 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:19:59 2010. How does this add to this case? Please stop spamming. This was a case where the kid lost a leg and should be charged, and he was caught as it was obvious from the lost leg.Please instead of spamming this board with brand new threads about graffitti or kids, etc go tell the media, go to your elected officials, but if you must compulsively rant here (which is not a blog site) at least have the decency (?sp) to add it to one of your millions of existing threads |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 13:29:29 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Karl M, Ex New Yorker on Mon Feb 15 13:24:25 2010. This I agree with too. They don't always necessarily show what can happen when they do illegal graffitti |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:30:48 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 12:07:11 2010. agreed 100% where were the parents? Don't you think this kid has graffiti written on his notebooks or backpack? I made the point a thousand times, if there was NO graffiti there on the track walls of the station or anywhere for that matter, this kid would not have gone there to do it. It is a very simple concept.To put it another way, if you are walking in a very industrial area and there is litter everywehre on the sidewalks, you may (I would never) consider dropping that bottle of water when you finish but if you were walking in an area that was pristine and there was absolutely no litter, I.E. Battery Park City There is no way you are dropping that finnished bottle of water. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:32:08 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by trainsarefun on Mon Feb 15 12:16:57 2010. He can still use his hands |
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Posted by Kriston Lewis on Mon Feb 15 13:39:28 2010, in response to 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Newkirk Images on Mon Feb 15 07:18:50 2010. Of course they'll sue. They'll probably say that the MTA failed to provide a safe environment for him to work on his "art". |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:40:01 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:19:59 2010. Just do what Giuliani proposed and have the city spray paint SUCKS under graffiti tags. Repeat offenders get SUCKS BIG TIME under their tags. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:41:50 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 13:24:04 2010. I wasn't making the point that it was cruel and unusual, that's arguable. I was pointing out that it would have to apply to everyone, or no one, not just people under 33. |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Mon Feb 15 13:41:55 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:30:48 2010. The parents are probably working long hours, and going to some storefront church on Saturdays, hoping God answers their prayers for a better life.I lived in Battery Park City for about three years. It was fun. I couldn't go back though. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:42:09 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:19:06 2010. Guess How old "MAP" is by now? |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by The Flxible Neofan on Mon Feb 15 13:42:36 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:40:01 2010. LOL, YES! |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:42:45 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:24:32 2010. Anybody could sue anyone, doesn't mean they'll get anywhere. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Mon Feb 15 13:44:51 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by The Flxible Neofan on Mon Feb 15 13:42:36 2010. That's a stupid idea. Vandals would turn violent against the people writing "Sucks". It would do nothing to discourage vandalism. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:46:01 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Kriston Lewis on Mon Feb 15 13:39:28 2010. No, they won't. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:46:47 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 12:19:06 2010. Guess How old "MAP" gothamist.com/2006/11/28/cops_graffiti_v.php |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:47:06 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by LuchAAA on Mon Feb 15 13:44:51 2010. LOL! |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Mon Feb 15 13:53:01 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Feb 15 13:47:06 2010. What? It was a funny skit.Sadly, the City does have a stupid policy of painting over tag names in such a way that you can still read the tag name underneath. |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:54:59 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by 9 local on Mon Feb 15 12:25:57 2010. IAWTP |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 13:55:40 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Karl M, Ex New Yorker on Mon Feb 15 12:28:21 2010. Agreed |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 14:02:53 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 12:46:10 2010. True True True, What about subway surfing? If someone fell off of the roof of a subway car do we sue the TA because the doors between cars were not locked? |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 14:04:40 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by Broadway Lion on Mon Feb 15 12:55:21 2010. agreed |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 14:17:20 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 13:27:46 2010. Becasue there is a good chance the NYC vandals squad knows who this kid is. he is probably in their data base if he has graduated to tagging track walls. If they were able to pick him up when they saw one of his new tags in the community, he probably would not have been out tagging again and woudl still have his legs. THe taggers know the law and that is why they continue! |
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Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Feb 15 14:18:27 2010, in response to Re: 'Graffiti Teen' Hit By Subway, posted by arnine on Mon Feb 15 13:29:29 2010. THey even have graffiti candy bars and graffiti stores in the village! |
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