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| Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” (1603432) | |
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Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jun 2 21:49:12 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jun 2 21:43:18 2022. To continue that thought. Hoboken is a nearby modern day example which proves that the ferry-rail combo can still work in the Tri-State area and for LIC more specifically, but the LIRR tried doing that with NY Waterway a couple of decades ago to little success, and neither the LIRR or NYC Ferry seemingly have any interest in coordinating their services with each other. |
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| (1603537) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Jun 2 22:02:52 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jun 2 21:49:12 2022. The problem is that Hoboken is right across from downtown where the offices are near the waterfront. LIC is across from 34th Street, which requires a long uphill walk or a bus trip to reach anyplace that LIRR passengers want to go. |
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| (1603542) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Jun 2 22:51:21 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by AlM on Thu Jun 2 19:14:53 2022. It depends on who gets the bill for suppling the utilities as in water, custodial services, electricity etc. If MN foots the bill for all that, and is responsible for all that maintenance and distribution, then its safe to say that MN is the landlord. I cant imagine say a pipe breaks or a electrical feeder fails that they would call in someone from Penn Sta to fix things. |
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| (1603547) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by ntrainride on Thu Jun 2 23:34:28 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Charles G on Thu Jun 2 18:05:56 2022. saint albans is a better location for considering increased service. elmont is just plain odd. first, it's no freeking way in elmont. "west bellerose terrace" is more like it. second, it already has a train station.if mainline service included floral park stops i could see garden city and hempstead ridership increasing as it would be a more comfortable way to get down to hempstead than catching a bus from mineola is. and a hell of a lot of people do that transfer. then again, i guess it can now be done via elmont so that's something good. it's just that floral park is the junction. i wonder if the railroad will come up with some type of special rate for those types of trips. the railfan in me just wants to see a three platform elevated floral park train station get more service. |
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| (1603558) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by AlM on Fri Jun 3 02:24:48 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Jun 2 22:02:52 2022. Yeah, I've always thought that any ferry enthusiasm was overdone when applied to getting workers to midtown. |
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| (1603559) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Fri Jun 3 04:21:56 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Jun 2 22:02:52 2022. That same access to Downtown Manhattan will be of advantage to Diesel riders/LIC after the new schedule is implemented too though. Why subject yourself to the madness at Jamaica during the rush, going upstairs to the overpass, crossing over every track to Platform F, walk back down to your Brooklyn train, get off at Atlantic Terminal, then finally squeeze yourself on to a packed subway train to Wall Street, when you can just stay on your train all the way to LIC and then get on an empty ferry to Wall Street or the WFC?That being said, I agree that using a ferry service to get to Midtown Manhattan isn’t that appealing on paper unless you live within walking distance of an outer slip, but NY Waterway/NYC Ferry/SeaStreak in conjunction with their prolific shuttle bus services have been showing that’s not exactly the case in actuality for over 3 decades now. |
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| (1603564) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Charles G on Fri Jun 3 07:30:27 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Joe V on Thu Jun 2 18:16:17 2022. Looking at the schedule again today, I suspect that it is a mistake.The weekend schedules listed for Floral Park through Hollis imply that trains originating in Hempstead would skip Floral Park and Bellerose and stop at Elmont, then run express to Jamaica. The weekend schedules listed for Stewart Manor through Hempstead imply that trains originating in Hempstead would make all stops except Elmont (which is consistent with current patterns and wouldn't require both Hempstead and Huntington trains crossing over multiple tracks. The schedules are fascinating - but there are likely many errors. They definitely missed a few things in proofreading (the Huntington schedule makes reference to Babylon branch express/local pattern with the Wantagh connection). Seems like they rushed a bit to get these out. |
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| (1603565) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Fri Jun 3 07:43:20 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Joe V on Thu Jun 2 16:40:02 2022. Same train never stops at both Kew Gardens and Forest Hills. Nothing wrong about that.Moreover, "No train stops at more than one of Kew Gardens, Forest Hills, or Woodside," as per one of the pages. |
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| (1603566) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by mtk52983 on Fri Jun 3 07:43:57 2022, in response to LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Jun 2 15:45:05 2022. Riders on Port Washington line living east of Bayside (and especially Port Washington through Great Neck) appear to get short end of the stick if they don’t have to be at work until 9. There are a bunch of early trains, but the current schedule has 4 Penn Station arrivals between 8:11 and 8:42. The new schedule has 1 in that time period if you live further out than Bayside. |
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| (1603574) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Allan on Fri Jun 3 11:09:00 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Italianstallion on Thu Jun 2 17:42:41 2022. But will people be willing to walk far? |
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| (1603576) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by AlM on Fri Jun 3 11:39:41 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Allan on Fri Jun 3 11:09:00 2022. From where?Very late night riders have usually been at some kind of event or party. They come from all over. I think Charles is right that there is an advantage to concentrating all late night service in one place, namely Penn Station. Also, there is an extra cost to keeping GCT-LIRR open late night. But keeping only the LIRR part of GCT open would be physically doable if they wanted to. From the LIRR concourse, there are 4 entrances to the street, one to GCT North (which is closed nights anyway), one to GCT lower level (which could easily be closed late nights), and maybe one or two to buildings (which probably close at about 8 PM anyway). |
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| (1603577) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Charles G on Fri Jun 3 11:43:16 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by New Flyer #857 on Fri Jun 3 07:43:20 2022. I was wondering whether the "no train stops at more than one of Kew Gardens, Forest Hills or Woodside" might impact the logistics of Shea Stadium connections via Woodside, but it appears there are still 4 tph eastbound from Woodside to Jamaica at times that games would be likely to end. |
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| (1603578) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Charles G on Fri Jun 3 11:52:24 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by mtk52983 on Fri Jun 3 07:43:57 2022. It is a very long spread for any westbound service from Port Washington through Douglaston during a time that one would think would be fairly peak in terms of rush hour demand.Departures from Port Washington are 7:17 - 28 min gap - 7:45 - 29 min gap - 8:14 - 10 min gap 8:24 - 9 min gap - 8:33. It may have a little bit to do with the single track east of Great Neck and the ability to get trains out to PW against the flow - but that doesn't explain why there are the same gaps in service from Great Neck through Douglaston. If they can deadhead trains to Bayside for short turns, why not sent them all the way to Great Neck? |
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| (1603579) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Mitch45 on Fri Jun 3 12:18:16 2022, in response to LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Jun 2 15:45:05 2022. That name is going to confuse many people. How stupid can the MTA be? |
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| (1603580) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Allan on Fri Jun 3 12:26:44 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Mitch45 on Fri Jun 3 12:18:16 2022. How stupid can the MTA be?Let me count the ways...... |
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| (1603581) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Fri Jun 3 12:47:08 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Charles G on Fri Jun 3 11:43:16 2022. I was concerned about equating the importance of Kew Gardens, Forest Hills, and Woodside. . .as if they all had the same demand. . .until I remembered that Woodside also has the Port Washington branch. |
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| (1603637) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 3 17:07:20 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Italianstallion on Thu Jun 2 20:47:28 2022. For Chuck Hoppe, it was a petty service cutting idea. Homeless was not a big deal by 1991, not like the earlier 1980's or now. |
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| (1603638) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 3 17:09:03 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Charles G on Fri Jun 3 07:30:27 2022. They left a Jamaica stop out from the weekend westbound Babylons. That can't be true. They pumped these drafts out to make a target date. But putting out a mess is not really making a target date. |
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| (1603639) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 3 17:09:38 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by AlM on Thu Jun 2 20:06:09 2022. I agree with that. |
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Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 3 17:19:32 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Jun 2 19:50:46 2022. They won't and they know it. |
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| (1603651) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by AlM on Fri Jun 3 17:27:54 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Jun 2 19:50:46 2022. That would be where most of the riders would come from.Not sure how you know that. But anyway, I made no mention as to how popular a very late night service from GCT might be. I actually agree with Charles that it is better to have the few late night trains all go from Penn. I was only saying that it would be easy (though of course not free) from a facility management point of view to keep the LIRR concourse open while shutting the rest of GCT. |
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| (1603653) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Jun 3 17:39:32 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by AlM on Fri Jun 3 17:27:54 2022. "Not sure how you know that."From working at GCT in customer service up until closin' time all those years ago. They'd either come up from the Lex Ave subway or various pubs on the east side, coming in from 2-3d & Lex Aves. Last trains were the 1:20 to Croton & the 1:30 to NWP. So if the LIRR was in town there then, they'd have to walk thru the main concourse to the MN lower level to the LIRR. Going thru the main concourse when coming in from the east side would be the only way to get to the LIRR. Problem is the Term closes now about 1:50AM |
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| (1603654) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Jun 3 17:45:43 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Italianstallion on Thu Jun 2 20:47:28 2022. I disagree. Homeless wasn't a big issue back in the early 70s. It was strictly a weak attempt to save $$$. Back then, Penn Central was doing everything in its power to discourage folks from riding their trains (as did Conrail later on).If Penn Central would have had a controlling interest in the LIRR, they probably would have tried to shut down Penn Sta overnight too. |
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| (1603660) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by AlM on Fri Jun 3 18:13:37 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Fri Jun 3 17:39:32 2022. Going thru the main concourse when coming in from the east side would be the only way to get to the LIRR.Walk crosstown on 45th - that works. Except of course it won't work late night because there won't be any LIRR trains. They'll have to get to Penn, which is fine. Better than the SOL people in MNRR territory. |
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Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Fri Jun 3 21:42:30 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 3 17:09:03 2022. Last minute rush without proofreading.They did the exact same thing with the proposed new Queens Bus Service Draft.....no proofreading there too. |
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Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Jun 4 06:29:44 2022, in response to LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Jun 2 15:45:05 2022. Interesting to see all off peak West Hempstead trains now running thru to Atlantic Terminal, along with 2 extra peak trains too/from Manhattan. Makes this line much more attractive.Liking the half hourly off peak service in the RO, BAB and Huntington lines, but what's up with all that service to Elmont? |
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| (1603757) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 4 12:06:26 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Jun 4 06:29:44 2022. Elmont - justifying a boondoggle ? |
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| (1603761) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Charles G on Sat Jun 4 12:14:35 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 4 12:06:26 2022. More likely a typo. |
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| (1603763) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 4 12:19:16 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Charles G on Sat Jun 4 12:14:35 2022. I wouldn't bet on that one. |
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| (1603764) | |
Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison” |
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Posted by Charles G on Sat Jun 4 12:22:31 2022, in response to Re: LIRR draft schedules for service to “Grand Central Madison”, posted by Charles G on Sat Jun 4 12:14:35 2022. Actually, I'll take that back. There are definitely typos in the Floral Park through Hollis pamphlet, but correcting for those, I think they still are planning 4 tph in each direction. |
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