Foto: Broadway Junction

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Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021 and ENY Yard. Click for full-res. Taken 07-11-21
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Subway Maps* on Mon Jul 12 10:35:01 2021, in response to Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021.* Beautiful shot!
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Mon Jul 12 11:08:28 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Subway Maps on Mon Jul 12 10:35:01 2021.* Thanks!
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Allan* on Mon Jul 12 11:09:55 2021, in response to Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021.* Fred, Fantastic photo. Where were you when you took it? Was it Alabama Av station?
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Mon Jul 12 11:12:30 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Allan on Mon Jul 12 11:09:55 2021.* Thanks, Allan. It's a drone shot, from about 100 or so feet above ground, not quite as far east as Alabama Avenue. It's a panorama shot consisting of 7 columns of 3 photos, or 21 photos altogether.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Allan* on Mon Jul 12 11:16:13 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 11:12:30 2021.* A drone shot!?!?! Amazing. I hope that will be more of these types of pics of the various areas of the system that we would not normally see.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Mon Jul 12 11:21:32 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Allan on Mon Jul 12 11:16:13 2021.* It's happening. Here's one from Smith-9th:
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Avid Reader* on Mon Jul 12 12:05:54 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 11:21:32 2021.* Can you capture videos too?
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by trains61* on Mon Jul 12 12:11:09 2021, in response to Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021.* Nice shot Fred. I have family members buried by the first tower, in Evergreen cemetery. On another note, a certain follow photog from CLE/United Van Lines and smoothjazzmixes said to give you his regards. He should have some primo shots of his own, real soon, on Facebook. He is currently vacationing in Puerto Rico. The Lurkers'Guild Grateful and on the ground in PHX
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Mon Jul 12 12:42:21 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Avid Reader on Mon Jul 12 12:05:54 2021.* Sure can. They're silent tho since a built in mic would only record propeller whine. One can add soundtrack tho, like music or whatever.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Mon Jul 12 12:43:14 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by trains61 on Mon Jul 12 12:11:09 2021.* Ok thanks and tell him Fred says hey.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by chicagomotorman* on Mon Jul 12 13:26:36 2021, in response to Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021.* WOW!!!!!!!!!! AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Mon Jul 12 16:02:02 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by chicagomotorman on Mon Jul 12 13:26:36 2021.* Thanks! 🙏🏽
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by LuchAAA* on Mon Jul 12 16:15:59 2021, in response to Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021.* Nice.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Bob Andersen* on Mon Jul 12 16:37:22 2021, in response to Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021.* I didn't realize there was still a lot of old steelwork on the Canarsie line towards Atlantic Ave. I thought they tore everything down except for the supports for the tracks that are still used.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Allan* on Mon Jul 12 16:44:00 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Bob Andersen on Mon Jul 12 16:37:22 2021.* It was probably cheaper to just leave the structure.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Mitch45* on Mon Jul 12 16:46:01 2021, in response to Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021.* Would've been amazing to see what it was like when it was in full service, with the Fulton Street elevated in operation.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by https://salaamallah.com/* on Mon Jul 12 16:50:30 2021, in response to Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021.* NICE PHOTO
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by VictorM* on Mon Jul 12 17:10:31 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Allan on Mon Jul 12 16:44:00 2021.* Also the abandoned portion provides structural stability to the in use portion. This is especially important on the Canarsie line between Atlantic and Sutter Avenues.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Mon Jul 12 21:37:10 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Bob Andersen on Mon Jul 12 16:37:22 2021.* There's quite a bit left and in this pic you can see the leads from Fulton Street. I left it huge for more detail. Sorry the sharpness suffers.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Mon Jul 12 21:39:19 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Mitch45 on Mon Jul 12 16:46:01 2021.* I'd love to see film of the works in motion.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Allan* on Tue Jul 13 11:39:26 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 21:37:10 2021.* Looks sharp to me. It is still nice to see the other two island platforms still there.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Mark S. Feinman* on Tue Jul 13 13:26:56 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 21:37:10 2021.* Looks sharp to me! That's a great picture, too! --Mark
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by zac* on Tue Jul 13 14:27:13 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 21:37:10 2021.* These are the leads to Fulton St from underneath.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Tue Jul 13 14:40:51 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by zac on Tue Jul 13 14:27:13 2021.* Beautiful 😍
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Allan* on Tue Jul 13 15:28:07 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Tue Jul 13 14:40:51 2021.* I agree. Funny how we can appreciate structures that most people barely pay attention to.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Mitch45* on Tue Jul 13 16:22:05 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 21:39:19 2021.* This junction, and the IRT/BMT connection at QVEENSBOROUGH PLAZA when the 2nd Avenue elevated was still running were marvels of engineering.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by randyo* on Tue Jul 13 16:56:40 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 21:37:10 2021.* The location of the Fulton St spur often made me wonder why a 3 tk 2 island express platform at Bway Jct on the Fulton wasn’t built since it could have provided a direct transfer to the Jamaica Line.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by zac* on Tue Jul 13 16:59:26 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Allan on Tue Jul 13 15:28:07 2021.* There are some more pics from there on my public Flickr. Just click on the photo in my prior post to get to them. Also pics from Shanghai Metro, Bordeaux-Paris TGV and Norway, and a very early attempt on the countdown clock at USQ, I think it was only on for a few days before they went back to the drawing board. And recorded the highest speed I've ever traveled on the ground, 269mph on the Shanghai maglev.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by zac* on Tue Jul 13 17:17:24 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by randyo on Tue Jul 13 16:56:40 2021.* Weren't the Fulton el and the Broadway el run by 2 different companies originally?
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Tue Jul 13 17:40:40 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Jul 13 16:22:05 2021.* I agree, those monstrosities in the air are part of the reason then New York subway is the greatest
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Avid Reader* on Tue Jul 13 20:17:45 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 21:37:10 2021.* If I were king, I'd select those segments that could be removed to then be used on the center track of the Jamaica el. Shirly not all are needed, and can be relocated.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Olog-hai* on Tue Jul 13 20:38:26 2021, in response to Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 10:13:30 2021.* Can almost hear a drone buzzing away . . . what an angle.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Express Rider* on Tue Jul 13 23:15:19 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Mon Jul 12 21:37:10 2021.* I was on the abandoned north platform in Spring 1968 photographing the disused northernmost track bed.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Express Rider* on Tue Jul 13 23:47:18 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Mitch45 on Mon Jul 12 16:46:01 2021.* IIRC one of Roger Arcara's videos has a short clip just south of B"way Junction & heading north back in the day. It's the video of BMT els. Maybe someone has put this up on Youtube?
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Avid Reader* on Wed Jul 14 08:19:23 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Express Rider on Tue Jul 13 23:15:19 2021.* Great! Share the photo, please!
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by VictorM* on Wed Jul 14 13:08:13 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Tue Jul 13 17:40:40 2021.* What's even more amazing is the 4 track IND subway passes directly under under this complex: (A&C shown in blue)
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Elkeeper* on Wed Jul 14 17:26:12 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by zac on Tue Jul 13 17:17:24 2021.* Yes, they were. After 1899, the Kings County (Fulton St) Elevated Ry became part of the BRT. Six years later, the Brooklyn & Rockaway Beach RR (Canarsie line) also became part of the BRT. Still does not answer the question why there was no Fulton St station at Broadway Junction, especially after the rebuilding of the Fulton St el from Utica Ave to Broadway Junction, after 1913.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Fred G* on Wed Jul 14 18:53:33 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by VictorM on Wed Jul 14 13:08:13 2021.* Unfortunately the IND did not reach Broadway Junction until 1946 when the Fulton Street el was already six years gone. I was hoping that the 4 track subway would have run in addition to all that el activity. There was reportedly a train that ran from 8th Avenue on the Canarsie line to Broadway Junction and then along the Fulton Street el to Lefferts.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by zac* on Wed Jul 14 19:42:45 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jul 14 17:26:12 2021.* It would have had to have been here: I don't know which way the Rockaway Ave station was built, towards that point or away from it, and we know where Atlantic Ave is. Maybe it was too short a distance? There were also crossovers to Rockaway Ave, but maybe those were added when the rest of the el was torn down. IDK. I wasn't there at the time, just that time I took the picture.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by randyo* on Wed Jul 14 20:40:22 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by zac on Wed Jul 14 19:42:45 2021.* That would be exactly where it would have to have been. As to where Rockaway Ave station was built, if a Bway Jct station were to have been built then the Rockaway Av station would simply have been built farther to the west.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by randyo* on Wed Jul 14 20:46:22 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Wed Jul 14 18:53:33 2021.* The service from 14/8 to Lefferts was the rush hour only 14/Fulton service which ran as a pseudo express skipping all stops between Lorimer and Myrtle and due to weight restrictions, used Multis exclusively. What I never understood is that the coding on the Hagstrom maps showed the lines where subway and elevated lines shared the same trackage as a subway line with the thin black elevated line in the middle on other lines that had a joint service yet the Fulton St el was never shown that way.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Elkeeper* on Wed Jul 14 20:47:35 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Fred G on Wed Jul 14 18:53:33 2021.* That would have been the BMT Multis, which ran from 1936-1960. There was not enough money to extend the IND Fulton subway beyond Rockaway Ave in 1936. The City then concentrated on funding the 6th Ave subway, which had won the lawsuits from the IRT and others.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by randyo* on Wed Jul 14 20:58:25 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Express Rider on Tue Jul 13 23:47:18 2021.* I think it is on Youtube as are many of Roger’s videos.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Elkeeper* on Wed Jul 14 21:06:36 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by randyo on Wed Jul 14 20:40:22 2021.* Actually, Rockaway Ave IND station was built between Rockaway Ave and Hopkinson Ave, which was west of Rock Ave. The mezzanine was put on the Hopkinson end because the Jamaica Ave trolley looped there.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by randyo* on Wed Jul 14 21:15:03 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jul 14 21:06:36 2021.* So then it wouldn’t have been difficult for the station on the el to have been located the same way. It was probably located where it was due to the lack of a Bway Jct station on the rebuilt el.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by randyo* on Wed Jul 14 21:20:30 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jul 14 20:47:35 2021.* I have seen several propose routings for the IND S/O Rockaway Ave which indicate that the route S/O there had not been fully finalized at the time the line opened. One proposal showed the subway continuing straight down Fulton St under the existing Jamaica el and connecting to the Liberty Av portion of the Fulton St from the north. Another had the subway turning down Liberty Av all the way from Penna Av and connecting to the Fulton el straight on near Crescent St. The last one was the one that was eventually built.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Express Rider* on Thu Jul 15 01:08:15 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by Avid Reader on Wed Jul 14 08:19:23 2021.* I wish I could but I don't have a scanner, and the photo is packed up in one of the boxes in my storage unit. Sorry about this.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by italianstallion* on Thu Jul 15 12:07:39 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by randyo on Wed Jul 14 20:46:22 2021.* Probably because the "subway" portion had such limited hours.
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Re: Foto: Broadway Junction
Posted by Elkeeper* on Thu Jul 15 13:48:35 2021, in response to Re: Foto: Broadway Junction, posted by randyo on Wed Jul 14 21:20:30 2021.* There were several, Randy. The current IND route under Pennsylvania Ave was a less expensive alternate plan from the original. That one would have run diagonally from under Jamaica & Pennsylvania Aves to the intersection of New Jersey & Liberty Aves. It was deemed to be too expensive and there were no plans on how it would connect to the Liberty Ave el. my favorite was the express tracks continuing under jamaica Ave to Ridgewood Ave, to Rockaway Blvd. No more specifics on that one were ever given. The things ya read about in the old Brooklyn Eagle!
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