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| Re: W coming back November 7 (1409825) | |
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| (1410039) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Sep 25 17:05:17 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Joe V on Sun Sep 25 14:24:35 2016. I didn’t have to disappear. The Suggestion Program rules are that after a specific period (I can’t recall how long) the suggestion can be implemented without giving any sort of credit or award to the one who suggested it. By the time the intelligent heads implemented it, the window had closed. |
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| (1410040) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Sep 25 17:06:42 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Joe V on Sun Sep 25 14:39:15 2016. Highly unlikely, since the R-68s are distributed among too many lines and the R-160s and up have FIND which can display any line. |
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| (1410042) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Sep 25 17:10:00 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Sep 25 13:30:02 2016. One theory I've had is they didn't bother to sort out the various cars after yard moves and just left them randomly mixed.As I've mentioned before, the only mixed consists I ever saw in those days were R-32/42 lashups on the D. |
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| (1410043) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by zac on Sun Sep 25 17:10:35 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Sep 25 13:30:02 2016. I recall that it happened all the time, and was the rule, not the exception. The only cars that weren't mixed were the R1-9, and the remaining standards, although I think the standards were gone by then maybe.But yea, it was usually an R40 or 42 thrown into a train of R27, 32, 38, or even R10. |
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| (1410044) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Sep 25 17:10:40 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Sep 25 12:31:49 2016. Borgaschmord trains!!! |
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| (1410045) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Sep 25 17:14:42 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Union Tpke on Sun Sep 25 15:23:33 2016. While I didn’t ride the BMT that much in 1961, I don’t recall the West End running to Astoria on Saturdays, but I did ride the Brighton Exp with D types on Saturday out of Astoria. |
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| (1410047) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Sep 25 17:17:59 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Sep 25 17:10:00 2016. You name it, they did it. |
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| (1410048) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Sep 25 17:18:52 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by zac on Sun Sep 25 17:10:35 2016. My craziest consist on the QJ was R42-R32-R27-R42 |
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| (1410050) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Sep 25 17:26:11 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Sep 25 17:10:00 2016. There actually was some logic to what they did there, especially trying to get as many air conditioned pairs onto as many trains as they could with the politicos demanding that THEIR constituents get them all and that just wasn't possible.As to the D, most of what ran came out of Concourse and so pretty much all they had to last some 42's onto was the 32's since arnines wouldn't work. :) |
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| (1410051) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Sep 25 17:26:52 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Sep 25 17:26:11 2016. (should have been LASH onto, not "last") |
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| (1410052) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Sep 25 17:37:35 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by zac on Sun Sep 25 17:10:35 2016. Yep ... aside from desperately trying to make service with anything that would build a full consist, getting at least a pair of air-conditioned cars onto as many trains as they could was the paramount move. Had to show the public that they were coming. :) |
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| (1410056) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Sep 25 18:22:39 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Joe V on Sun Sep 25 16:26:25 2016. Although I never rode on a T, I saw one leaving Union Square on a Saturday in the fall of 1967 on the express track. I would imagine they skipped 49th St. on Saturdays, since by then they only went as far as 57th St. |
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| (1410059) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Sep 25 19:12:36 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Sep 25 17:10:00 2016. Since CIYd had R-42s from just about all the lines with the exception of the Queens IND, whatever OK cars the Yardmaster had were used to make service regardless of signage. One SundayI was working as the West End T/D and due to an impending visit from Ronan to 57/6, a CLEAN train of R-42s properly signed for the B was requested for a particular interval lvg Stl. I advised the Yd/Mast at CIY and was extremely surprised when a train of R-42s showed up that looked like it had been dragged through CI Creek instead of operating over it. I Immediately phoned the Yd Mast who said that was the only train of R-42s he had available. I couldn’t figure out why it couldn’t have been sent through the wash but that was what I got and I sent it. The T/D at 57/6 phoned me to find out why such a cruddy excuse for train was sent there considering it was a special occasion and I told him about the Yd/Mast’s response. All he said was that Joe Kilkenny (the Chief of Operations who was also there) will be very disappointed. I never did find out what the eventual consequences were of what happened. |
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| (1410060) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Sep 25 19:14:40 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Joe V on Sun Sep 25 17:18:52 2016. One Sunday on the RR I had an R-16, 2 R-42s, 2 R-27s, 2 R-32s and an R-16 at the other end. The train barely made it to Qnsbro Plz. |
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| (1410061) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Sep 25 19:17:29 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Sep 25 18:22:39 2016. Ts also bypassed 49 St Mon - Fri as well unless there was unusual congestion S/O 57 St in which case, the plat C/R at 34 St would be instructed to have the M/M punch for the lcl tk instead of the exp. |
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| (1410083) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Andrew Saucci on Sun Sep 25 23:42:06 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Union Tpke on Sun Sep 25 15:23:33 2016. Interesting that the poster does not have any letter or number designations on it at all. |
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| (1410095) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Express Rider on Mon Sep 26 06:26:10 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by X-Astorian on Sun Sep 25 13:46:05 2016. iawtp! |
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| (1410096) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Sep 26 06:42:03 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Sep 25 17:10:40 2016. R42's and R10's on the same train still blows my mind. Not sure how electric and pneumatic doors worked together. |
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| (1410099) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Sep 26 08:22:23 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Andrew Saucci on Sun Sep 25 23:42:06 2016. Yeah, also never realized that the Brighton Express once went to Astoria, even if only for one day a week. I probably should have figured that out given the Franklin Ave arrangement but never put it together.Things were still simple enough back then to not warrant the lettering, especially if people knew their line names. I guess on Queens Blvd you had a mix of lettered and non-lettered (BMT) trains. |
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| (1410112) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Sep 26 10:00:49 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Sep 26 06:42:03 2016. Why would this be a problem? I assume that the pneumatic doors were still electrically controlled. I mean, there wasn't an air tube going through the couplers just for the doors. |
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| (1410113) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Mon Sep 26 10:09:27 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Sep 25 12:31:49 2016. look how clean everything was. In modern 2016, every inch of the stone and track walls along every route are covered with graffiti. |
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| (1410122) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by FYBklyn1959 on Mon Sep 26 10:33:58 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun Sep 25 11:10:16 2016. And with Darth Vader brakes < sigh > |
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| (1410131) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 12:15:14 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Sep 26 06:42:03 2016. Like Spider-Pig said, door controls are just another set of pins on the electric portion that tells relays to pull in or drop in order to activate or deactivate the mechanisms as required. FWIW though, the action on air engines vs. electric door engines was slower, so the doors on the R10's did slow down each stop a tad. |
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| (1410146) | |
Re: Allan, that is great news, W coming back November 7. |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Sep 26 13:50:10 2016, in response to Re: Allan, that is great news, W coming back November 7., posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Sep 25 14:54:11 2016. Amazing that Subchat's history is now longer than Subtalk's. |
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| (1410156) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by X-Astorian on Mon Sep 26 15:17:13 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Sep 26 08:22:23 2016. The R27s just started arriving in mid-November 1960 - there weren't all that many around by the time of this changeover so most riders didn't see or recognize the letters. BTW, for the previous five years, Brighton Expresses went to Astoria five or six days a week. |
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| (1410165) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Sep 26 15:43:45 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 12:15:14 2016. When the R-16s were on the A in the 1950s, it was common to see mixed trains of R-10s with air doors and R-16s with electric doors in the same train, usually 8 of on e kind and 2 of the other depending on car availability. |
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| (1410166) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Bill Newkirk on Mon Sep 26 15:59:45 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun Sep 25 12:31:49 2016.  Line: BMT Franklin...Location: Dean Street... Route: Franklin Shuttle Car: R-38 (St. Louis, 1966-1967) 3962... Photo by: Joe Testagrose...Date: 3/24/1973.from nycsubway.org |
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| (1410172) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Sep 26 16:21:57 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Bill Newkirk on Mon Sep 26 15:59:45 2016. Interesting!. I’ve seen plenty of trains with 2 R-32s and an R-11 but never casuist an R-38/11 mix. |
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| (1410175) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Mon Sep 26 16:55:05 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by randyo on Mon Sep 26 16:21:57 2016. Yup. Never seen that photo or a consist like that before. Awesome. |
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| (1410177) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Joe V on Mon Sep 26 17:21:36 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by randyo on Sun Sep 25 19:12:36 2016. The D and QJ were both Brighton services, but I doubt any had signs for both the D and QJ - separate allottments. |
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| (1410179) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Joe V on Mon Sep 26 17:25:18 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by randyo on Mon Sep 26 16:21:57 2016. I think one or two R16's got a R32-like paint job for the FS, to be mixed with R32's, yet they never made it over there. |
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| (1410187) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 18:13:44 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by randyo on Mon Sep 26 15:43:45 2016. Trying to remember, but I think the R10's and R16's had the same manufacturer for the different door motors, that would help. :) |
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| (1410190) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 18:49:05 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 18:13:44 2016. IIRC they were made by National Pneumatic, although the R-16s had electric door engines. |
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| (1410191) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 18:55:47 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Sep 25 17:26:52 2016. Every mixed consist I saw had R-32s at the points and R-42s in the middle. |
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| (1410192) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 18:56:47 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 18:49:05 2016. I believe so as well, and they were probably designed to be compatible. |
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| (1410193) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 18:57:54 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by randyo on Sun Sep 25 19:12:36 2016. I'll bet someone said, "Lucy, you got some 'splainin' to do!" or something to that effect. |
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| (1410194) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 19:01:28 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 12:15:14 2016. Say what you want about Train Dude, but he was kind enough to explain how it all worked. It didn't matter what activated the doors - trigger box, lever aka faucet handle or pushbutton. The trainline circuits on all SMEE cars were tied to the same pins in the electric portions, so they were compatible. |
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| (1410195) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 19:02:00 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon Sep 26 06:42:03 2016. Thank God I never saw such a consist. I would have thrown a screaming fit on the spot. |
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| (1410196) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 19:05:06 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Bill Newkirk on Mon Sep 26 15:59:45 2016. What's really amazing is that those cars are actually CLEAN, considering the graffiti epidemic was in full swing by 1973. |
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| (1410197) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 19:11:57 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 18:55:47 2016. On the D, I ran a solid consist a couple of times, and occasionally there were just a pair on the north end. |
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| (1410198) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 19:12:39 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 19:01:28 2016. Yep. |
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| (1410201) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Joe V on Mon Sep 26 19:18:47 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by X-Astorian on Mon Sep 26 15:17:13 2016. Did a Triplex ever see Queens Blvd service off the BMT ? |
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| (1410202) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Joe V on Mon Sep 26 19:21:09 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 12:15:14 2016. Any photos anywhere of these mixed R10/R16 train on the A, or for that matter on the Eastern Division ? |
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| (1410203) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Joe V on Mon Sep 26 19:22:15 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 19:02:00 2016. Oh please, some people would have been grabbing their crotches. |
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| (1410206) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Sep 26 19:34:21 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Joe V on Mon Sep 26 19:21:09 2016. Not that I know of, but they were out there. :) |
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| (1410216) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Mon Sep 26 21:42:49 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 26 19:05:06 2016. I get the sense that the graffiti came out all at once. Pics right through 1971 show graffiti-free cars, 1972 show some here and there, and like you say, by 1973, it was sadly universal.Born in '68, I do not remember the pre-graffiti days. It seemed natural to me as a kid, as I had only remembered the subway like that. Once it was gone, I was amazed!! |
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| (1410217) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Mon Sep 26 21:45:03 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Bill Newkirk on Sun Sep 25 09:39:45 2016. I love those H AND M tiles. They were briefly visible again in 1996, during a renovation... |
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| (1410227) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Ian Lennon on Tue Sep 27 01:55:06 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by randyo on Mon Sep 26 16:21:57 2016. Technically a R-34, with R-32. |
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| (1410232) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by Dyre Dan on Tue Sep 27 05:54:09 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by New Flyer #857 on Mon Sep 26 08:22:23 2016. Interesting that they ran Brighton Expresses on Saturdays at all in 1961, and all day too. I thought that was always M-F only, plus Saturday mornings before WW II (roughly). And Franklin Ave. still had full-length platforms, in good enough condition to serve as the main destination of Brighton locals, even if only one day a week. I guess that meant 8 cars, there were never 10-car platforms there, right? So the other six days a week it was a shuttle like today, but Saturdays it was the primary local service? I'd heard about the "Sunny Summer Sunday" thru service from Franklin, but that was supplemental to local service to Manhattan, no? |
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| (1410244) | |
Re: W coming back November 7 |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Tue Sep 27 08:03:37 2016, in response to Re: W coming back November 7, posted by Union Tpke on Sun Sep 25 15:23:33 2016. That's very interesting. So- from this poster, I see that there was still Brighton-Franklin service in the early 60s. I thought it had stopped a few years earlier.Also, I see that the 4th Avenue line (the weekday version identical to today's R) ran to 57th Street outside of weekday midday and rush hours. Did it run local on Broadway when running to 57th? If so, that would seem like some of the silly switching they do now (like the N at Prince St.) Also, did the 4th Ave line run via Whitehall or via the Manny B back then? |
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