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| Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? (1364263) | |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:10:54 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 13:11:26 2015. I'm talking about taking CT Limo to EWR, JFK, or LGA vs taking your foamer route |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:12:41 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 13:28:03 2015. Again, try it when you have kids that don't want to or can not carry their own luggage and you've now gotta manage your bags, their bags, and keep an eye on them |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:14:15 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 13:16:07 2015. Yes, YOU have done it, you've mentioned that several times, and that's great for you. I'm telling you that not everyone is as capable as you. So mazal tov, your the fucking hulk of both strength and patience. Good for you. No one gives a shit. |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by merrick1 on Mon Sep 7 14:38:08 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:14:15 2015. He may be the hulk of strength but apparently he is somewhat weak of bladder :) |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by merrick1 on Mon Sep 7 15:18:51 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:09:49 2015. The 2012 Ground Transportation stats were the most recent I could find with a quick Google search. (Scroll to page 59)Airtrain Jamaica and Howard Beach 5,706,207 Paid Parked Cars 4,154,895 Taxi (Outbound Only) 3,250,056 New York Airport Service Bus 346,749 Ground Transportation Center (other buses (incl CT Limo), vans, car services) (outbound only) 204,480 Assuming the number of people arriving by taxi is similar to the number leaving the airport by taxi, taxi would seem to be the winner. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by subfan on Mon Sep 7 16:04:15 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 13:28:03 2015. "Short" walk? .7 of a mile along the John F. Fitzgerald Surface Road does not meet the general definition of a "short" walk when traveling with luggage - and the vast majority of people would not consider it a "connection" either. You are correct that one could take the Silver Line bus, but I was addressing the route you reported taking.And you also can't really compare walking for a connection in a terminal to this walk, since in a terminal, you're not generally lugging your checked luggage with you. So - in conclusion, you're some combination of Superman, the Incredible Hulk, and a masochist, and will make sure you always use public transportation to get to the airport. Planners, on the other hand, need to take into account what the general populace is likely to do - and despite everything you've said (at increasing virtual volume, I might add), people with luggage, children, etc. are just not willing to take the roundabout routes you propose - and as one who, I'm quite sure, travels more than you do, I think there right. And yes I do often take both the subway/AirTrain and Blue Line/shuttle bus route myself. subfan |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:47:27 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:02:29 2015. The question you're asking is whether non-FRA trains should have bathrooms. That's a totally different discussion. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:47:47 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:04:45 2015. At least the railroad is already there, so their NIMBY claims, while they would be loud, have no merit. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:48:56 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:05:28 2015. It does. But not that much, especially for a route that doesn't really go anywhere. Building more highways to nowhere is not a good plan for the future. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:51:27 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by merrick1 on Mon Sep 7 15:18:51 2015. Wow, that's surprising. Then again, we're dealing with a bunch of lazy Americans for the most part, so maybe it's not that surprising.Paid parked cars makes more sense, since a lot of the folks are from LI, or somewhere else that might not have great mass transit access. Does the Ground Transportation Center include hotel shuttles? Those are probably less of a factor in NYC, but still, those are an essential link. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:53:51 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:10:54 2015. It's not a foamer route, it's actually the best way to get there. The bigger question is whether you want to deal with the mess that Delta has created at JFK, but if you do, then the AirTrain, and whatever feeds it from where you live is going to be one option, driving your own car the other, depending on where you live. Anything else isn't worth wasting time considering. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:54:39 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 14:12:41 2015. Teaching 'Muricans to be lazy from a young age! 'Murica **** yeah! |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Mon Sep 7 16:54:50 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:47:27 2015. The question you're asking is whether non-FRA trains should have bathrooms.The question is why should a urban service on mainline tracks feature bathrooms just because it's merely on mainline tracks? London Overground and some of the high frequency networks in South London are similar substitutes, and they have near subway frequencies, yet don't have bathrooms. Why should we sacrifice passenger space on bathrooms for a service that pretty much acts like a subway? |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:58:48 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by subfan on Mon Sep 7 16:04:15 2015. .7 miles is no big deal. That's an easy connection.That's great if you're flying on Southwest, where you actually GET checked luggage, unlike most other airlines. I still don't check bags. The only time my bag has been checked was on the Alaska RR, since you can't carry them on. No, I don't always use public transit, but the availability of it is a big plus for the big city airports over our local airports where you have to drive and pay to park. If you really travel that much, you'd likely be packing lighter than the typical "max out" way that I travel with a stuffed suitcase and backpack to max out what I'm allowed to take on the plane, so it would be that much easier to walk .7 miles to connect between two things. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 17:01:46 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Mon Sep 7 16:54:50 2015. Commuter rail is commuter rail, not a subway. TriboroRX would be the first service in the US to break that barrier. RTD and SEPTA are both commuter rail, and should have bathrooms. The FRA should use their regulatory power to force all rail operations under their jurisdiction to have bathrooms, and then issue waivers if necessary, although if I were them, I would simply refuse to issue waivers. PATH can just leave the FRA regulatory structure, since they don't connect to anything else anyway, and shouldn't be FRA in the first place. They are a subway. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Mon Sep 7 17:21:59 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 17:01:46 2015. should have bathroomsI'll take the bait. Why should SEPTA endure the cost burden of bathrooms? |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Mon Sep 7 19:54:48 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ntrainride on Sun Sep 6 10:50:57 2015. No way! Absolutely not! The population of the Rockaways, Broad Channel and Howard Beach will not trade more frequent, affordable subway service for infrequent, overpriced LIRR service with limited connections to the subway and local buses. And the LIRR, in keeping with its focus on Nassau and Suffolk counties, is not looking to take back the RBB. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 20:41:50 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Mon Sep 7 17:21:59 2015. Because humans might need to actually USE them. Every other commuter rail operation in the entire country, with the exception of old Metra Electric equipment, and RTD, which bought the StupidLiners, has bathrooms.SEPTA's excuses about maintaining bathrooms are utterly and totally LAME. MN maintains bathrooms. LIRR maintains bathrooms. MBTA maintains bathrooms. NJT maintains bathrooms. MARC maintains bathrooms. See the pattern? And their excuse about having different terminals that trains end up in is utterly ridiculous NJT, MBTA, and LIRR all also operate networks with many remote storage yards, and they all pump the toilets somehow. No Canadian operator has bathrooms, but AFAIK, they all offer washrooms, even on the new Union-Pearson Express in Toronto. In fact, in their sales pitch, washrooms are one of the amenities listed as a feature of their service. Far as I can tell, the only substantive difference being that washrooms, like everything else in Canada, are far cleaner than most bathrooms. MN needs trash cans, but lacking trash cans isn't nearly as bad as bathrooms. And I believe SEPTA also lacks trash cans. Probably should be another FRA rule. Unfortunately, it boils down to the bottom line that SEPTA hates their customers, and that the leadership of SEPTA would like to haul all the trains into a yard and scrap them rather than actually operate a commuter railroad. It's a shame that this type of attitude exists. They make LIRR's total lack of competence look good in comparison. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 20:45:22 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Mon Sep 7 19:54:48 2015. Maybe the issues with the LIRR providing crappy service need to be addressed first. And the CityTicket pricing. It would be better service overall, with direct service to NYP, GCT, Atlantic Ave, and Jamaica via the loop. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Sep 7 21:13:26 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 20:41:50 2015. The trash can stupidity--also the case at BART--is another pretense of enhanced security as if having garbage cans would encourage terrorists. BART also used security as the excuse to close bathrooms in the most heavily used stations, but not in the suburbs. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 21:30:40 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:47:27 2015. No, my question is why the regulatory body is the determining factor in whether the train should have a bathroom instead of the amount of time a passenger spends on that train. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 21:31:39 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:47:47 2015. And you think providing a safer crossing for pedestrians over Linden Blvd wouldn't be appreciated? |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 21:34:40 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:48:56 2015. A highway from the VZ, over the Bay Ridge and over Linden Blvd to the Conduit certainly goes more than just no where. It opens a limited access commercial route to the south shore of Long Island, southern Queens, and central Brooklyn, as well as JFK Airport, that doesn't currently exist. And sure, lights wouldn't effect the LIE that much, okay. I'll believe ya when me shit turns purple and smells like rainbow sherbert |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 21:43:32 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:53:51 2015. How is it the best way to get there? How long does your route take from New Haven? CT Limo schedule says it takes 3 hours or less from New Haven. Google is saying 3.5 hours for the fastest train route, and that's with taking MN, 7, LIRR, and Airtrain. So how is your "best way to get there" better than taking a shorter bus ride that requires no transfers? |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 21:44:16 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:54:39 2015. You've completely missed the point. I hope you get it when it's time to be responsible for people other than yourself |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 21:45:53 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by merrick1 on Mon Sep 7 14:38:08 2015. And elsewhere too... (taps head) |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Sep 7 23:45:07 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 03:16:10 2015. Heh, he took a cab. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Mon Sep 7 23:46:45 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 20:45:22 2015. No, it would not be better service overall. Just because the LIRR would have direct service to NYP, GCT (assuming ESA is finally open) and Jamaica, doesn't make it a better service. Because those would be the only three destinations that it would have direct service to. Anything else would require paying another fare to connect to the subway or a local bus. With the A train, there is direct access to much of central and downtown Brooklyn, Lower Manhattan, Midtown (including Penn Station, btw) and Upper Manhattan. And if the M or R were to be extended down to the Rockaways on the part of the RBB that's currently out of service, that opens up direct access to Rego Park, Elmhurst, Jackson Heights, Astoria, Long Island City and East Midtown.Why would residents of the Rockaways, Broad Channel and Howard Beach want to give that up for more expensive, less frequent LIRR service? Because nicer seats (not necessarily more comfortable) and bathrooms? Come on now! Does the LIRR even want to go back to the Rockaways and Broad Channel? They really don't seem to be in any hurry to go back there, otherwise we'd have known about it already. And if your concerned about crappy LIRR service, go take it up with the MTA and LIRR management. They decide how frequently the service runs and which lines get more service. See what they tell you. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Mon Sep 7 23:47:10 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 20:45:22 2015. No, it would not be better service overall. Just because the LIRR would have direct service to NYP, GCT (assuming ESA is finally open) and Jamaica, doesn't make it a better service. Because those would be the only three destinations that it would have direct service to. Anything else would require paying another fare to connect to the subway or a local bus. With the A train, there is direct access to much of central and downtown Brooklyn, Lower Manhattan, Midtown (including Penn Station, btw) and Upper Manhattan. And if the M or R were to be extended down to the Rockaways on the part of the RBB that's currently out of service, that opens up direct access to Rego Park, Elmhurst, Jackson Heights, Astoria, Long Island City and East Midtown.Why would residents of the Rockaways, Broad Channel and Howard Beach want to give that up for more expensive, less frequent LIRR service? Because nicer seats (not necessarily more comfortable) and bathrooms? Come on now! Does the LIRR even want to go back to the Rockaways and Broad Channel? They really don't seem to be in any hurry to go back there, otherwise we'd have known about it already. And if you are concerned about crappy LIRR service, go take it up with the MTA and LIRR management. They decide how frequently the service runs and which lines get more service. See what they tell you. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by subfan on Tue Sep 8 05:26:31 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 16:58:48 2015. As a heavy traveler, I pack more lightly than most (rarely more than a carry-on and a computer bag), which is why I do, in fact, often use mass transit to get to the airport. I don't, though, extrapolate from my experience to the general traveler, which is what you are doing.And about a .7 mile walk with luggage being a big deal or not - I think we'll just have to agree to disagree. subfan |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Tue Sep 8 05:53:50 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ntrainride on Mon Sep 7 10:05:36 2015. With only 4 tph (at best)? I don't think so! |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Tue Sep 8 07:30:31 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by subfan on Tue Sep 8 05:26:31 2015. I'll believe you over him any day. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by R30A on Tue Sep 8 11:57:05 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Mon Sep 7 20:41:50 2015. I cannot comment on MARC, but to say that MN, LIRR, NJT, or MBTA "maintain" their bathrooms is a MAJOR stretch to say the least. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Sep 8 14:53:21 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by R30A on Tue Sep 8 11:57:05 2015. somehow we keep most airport bathrooms clean; why we don't do the same for transit is another example of dissing transit users by the society in general. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:10:31 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by R30A on Tue Sep 8 11:57:05 2015. Well, they at least pump them out once in a while, even if they don't maintain them per se. And the M-8's have vacuum flush toilets. So that's something. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:12:28 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by #5 - Dyre Ave on Mon Sep 7 23:46:45 2015. The Rockaway subway line is ridiculous. Sure, it has slow as molasses direct service to a few more places than LIRR, that still doesn't make it make one bit of sense whatsoever. The NYCT saved that line by putting a subway train on it, but it still doesn't make any sense. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:13:33 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 21:43:32 2015. Because it's some stupid little bus that's not going to get there any faster than driving your own car. Stupid. The trains don't get stuck in traffic, they are more comfortable, and more convenient. So there. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:16:53 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Mon Sep 7 21:30:40 2015. Fine. Then argue that subways over a certain time should have bathrooms on them. That doesn't really make any sense, and it's not a discussion that I want to bother with. You don't seem to understand the fundamental difference between commuter rail and rapid transit. SEPTA is commuter rail. RTD is commuter rail.TriboroRX would be the first in the US (other than PATH, which should drop it's FRA status) to break the mold and operate as rapid transit under FRA rules. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Sep 8 16:19:14 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:16:53 2015. other than PATH, which should drop its FRA statusWhy? Never mind it not being up to PATH. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Union Tpke on Tue Sep 8 16:27:55 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:12:28 2015. fine, but you would have to lower the fares below the subway fare to $1.50 to $2 because of the lack of destinations and the 4tph. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Sep 8 18:02:04 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:12:28 2015. It makes just as much sense as WMATA service to the Virginia and Maryland suburbs and the MBTA services to Oak Grove and Braintree! |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Tue Sep 8 19:42:57 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by randyo on Tue Sep 8 18:02:04 2015. well said. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by TerrapIN StatiON on Tue Sep 8 21:16:54 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:12:28 2015. Wrong |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 8 21:54:52 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:12:28 2015. I seriously disagree. I grew up in Far Rockaway, and lived there again as an adult. The (A) service is essential, and is, IMO, the least expensive, and most reliable way to reach Manhattan. Sixty years of subway service has borne this out. The severe disruption to Rockaway life when subway service stopped after Hurricane Sandy, is sufficient evidence establishing the necessity and viability of this route and service. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Sep 8 22:19:58 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:12:28 2015. That rocket ride I took in July of 1969 was anything but slow. Once we had cleared that bridge, we were off to the races. That R-10 Abbott took off as though it had a Saturn V booster strapped to it. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Tue Sep 8 22:40:34 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by ElectricTraction on Tue Sep 8 16:13:33 2015. I just told you that your route takes even more time than the bus, so how is travel time compared to driving even a part of your argument? Also, the subway is definitely not more comfortable than a coach bus. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by #4 Sea Beach Fred on Wed Sep 9 00:26:10 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by subfan on Tue Sep 8 05:26:31 2015. This thread has been on here for a long time but for me light rail out here in the Los Angeles Metropolitan area is like manna from Heaven since it might alleviate the traffic on our freeways which seem like parking lots most of the time. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Sep 9 01:08:10 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by #4 Sea Beach Fred on Wed Sep 9 00:26:10 2015. Indeed the restoration of PE routes (Expo, Blue) and the new ones are a huge improvement. And, now that subways are legal again, (kinda like the end of Prohibition) the Wilshire line to the Sea will be really useful. Come in on Amtrak, take subway to LACMA/the Tar Pits. (at present one gets a bus for the run down Wilshire) |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Sep 9 04:33:22 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by #4 Sea Beach Fred on Wed Sep 9 00:26:10 2015. Libs loved freeways too much in the third quarter of the twentieth century. |
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Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again? |
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Posted by salaamallah@hotmail.com on Wed Sep 9 05:29:45 2015, in response to Re: Someone remind me, what is the point of light rail again?, posted by #4 Sea Beach Fred on Wed Sep 9 00:26:10 2015. do you use it ? |
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