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| Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan (1347018) | |
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| (1347091) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by R30A on Wed Apr 8 18:35:30 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Apr 8 18:30:38 2015. Amtrak has no 9001(Neither will MNCR when this order comes in, but they will have 9100+). Regardless of such, It is still a needless source of confusion. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Apr 8 18:42:27 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Union Tpke on Wed Apr 8 17:40:52 2015. no it is DC only |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by ClearAspect on Wed Apr 8 18:43:53 2015, in response to LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Apr 8 10:10:46 2015. Beautiful car! |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Apr 8 18:45:12 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Wado MP73 on Wed Apr 8 18:31:07 2015. one of reasons is they do not want a pair of M9's ending in M-7 train as the M-9 is a few inches wider and does not clear on certain branch lines. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Apr 8 19:19:17 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by randyo on Wed Apr 8 17:00:39 2015. The days of old school LIRR mentality are long gone.In the day, all of their equiptment was able to run together in one train. I remember seeing a train of MP72 & 75s MP54 clestory & arched roofed & the Juinata built double deckers all together in one 12 car train. They specifically ordered from Pullman that their MP-75 Worlds Fair "Zip Cars" be able to MU with 45/50 year old equiptment. That type of flexibility made for interesting railfanning & more available cars per train. Railroad suits just don't think that way anymore. |
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| (1347099) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Apr 8 19:27:15 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Apr 8 19:19:17 2015. propulsion is no longer a one size fits all DC gear, the AC gear is much more complicated. main thing is on LIRR there are close clearances and running a M-9 which is several inches wider as M-7 in same train will cause problems as sooner or later someone forgets. |
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| (1347100) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by steamdriven on Wed Apr 8 19:36:18 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Apr 8 19:27:15 2015. Why shave all the platforms back to the same &^$% width.Heck, why stop there: On either the trains or the platforms (mmm, not both) maybe add a fixed, plastic gap filler which can squash a bit if the train rocks. There's almost no gap on the subway. |
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| (1347102) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Andrew Saucci on Wed Apr 8 19:52:28 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Newkirk Images on Wed Apr 8 13:46:03 2015. That was just another stupid bureaucratic decision. There was no need for overlap, so why have it? As my mother would say whenever my sister or I would ask to do something stupid, "it isn't necessary." |
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| (1347109) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Apr 8 20:46:29 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Apr 8 19:27:15 2015. " M-9 which is several inches wider as M-7"Makes me wonder why did they agree to the clearence differences in the M-9 order first place. Will MN have clearence issues then the M-9 shows up there?? |
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| (1347111) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Apr 8 20:52:20 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Apr 8 20:46:29 2015. nope the M-9 is same width as M-8 the M-7 was designed very narrow for one of branch lines on LIRR. |
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| (1347115) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by The Silence on Wed Apr 8 21:33:18 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by MainR3664 on Wed Apr 8 18:03:53 2015. meanwhile there is someone on RR.net who's practically demanding they use M9As. |
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| (1347121) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Apr 8 22:28:59 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by steamdriven on Wed Apr 8 19:36:18 2015. …unless the platform is on a curve. |
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| (1347127) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by SUBWAYMAN on Wed Apr 8 23:54:08 2015, in response to LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Apr 8 10:10:46 2015. Cool! |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by R30A on Thu Apr 9 00:19:00 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by The Silence on Wed Apr 8 21:33:18 2015. They may be arguing that, but it obviously won't happen, for the reasons you so clearly laid out over there. |
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| (1347134) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by R30A on Thu Apr 9 00:39:28 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Apr 8 18:45:12 2015. M9s are wider than M7s sure, but not M3s. M3s fit everywhere. Width is not an issue. |
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| (1347146) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by R 36 ML 9542 on Thu Apr 9 02:59:26 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by SUBWAYMAN on Wed Apr 8 23:54:08 2015. Interesting, I like it. How many M-9s are on order for the LIRR and the MNRR? |
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| (1347154) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Thu Apr 9 07:06:52 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by R 36 ML 9542 on Thu Apr 9 02:59:26 2015. The Long Island Rail Road Company (“LIRR”), as the lead agency, on behalf of itself and Metro-North Commuter Railroad Company (“MNR” and together with LIRR, the “Railroads”) hereby solicit Joint Procurement, Phase 1–Qualification Proposals from firms for the design, manufacture, test and delivery of 76 M-9 Married-Pair EMU Cars (38 A Cars and 38 B Cars) for LIRR, which together with certain Apparatus (spare parts, special tools, bench test equipment, etc., as specified in the Contract Documents), are considered the "Base Order Cars". As part of this procurement, the Railroads also intend to procure up to 600 additional M-9, including up to 280 MNCR Cars.LIRR also intends to procure 160 M-9A Cars, which will be solicited separately and in a subsequent RFP pursuant to Federal procurement laws and regulations. In previous Requests for Expression of Interest published between August 2008 and September 2011, LIRR initially determined that the M-9 and M-9A Cars would be procured in two separate but related procurements concurrently. However, LIRR has now determined that it will purchase the M-9A Cars in a subsequent procurement, which is scheduled for June 2013. The M-9A Cars will be solicited based upon substantially identical Technical Provisions as the M-9 Cars, and must be interoperable with M-9 Cars. To the extent feasible, the Railroads will seek to maximize the commonality of Parts and Systems between the M-9 and M-9A. The M-9 Contractor will be responsible for providing complete technical information and rights to such information so as to permit the subsequent production of fully interoperable M-9A Cars. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Apr 9 07:17:21 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Mr. MTA on Wed Apr 8 16:25:16 2015. That has nothing to do with anything. LOL. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Apr 9 07:17:48 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Apr 8 18:25:33 2015. Nope. That's faulty reasoning. |
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| (1347158) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Apr 9 07:26:29 2015, in response to LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Apr 8 10:10:46 2015. Why would they remove the post? |
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| (1347161) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by WillD on Thu Apr 9 07:49:45 2015, in response to LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Apr 8 10:10:46 2015. From that angle it looks a lot like a 1970s BREL DMU or EMU to me. Maybe a Class 313 or 508: "WAGN313038-FinsburyPark-20040928" by Janderk1968 - Own work. Licensed under CC BY-SA 3.0 via Wikimedia Commons.  "To Hunts Cross, Hightown Railway Station (geograph 2994466)" by El Pollock. Licensed under CC BY-SA 2.0 via Wikimedia Commons. |
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| (1347163) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Thu Apr 9 08:08:32 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by WillD on Thu Apr 9 07:49:45 2015. Moorgate!!!!! |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Mr. MTA on Thu Apr 9 09:11:30 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Apr 9 07:17:21 2015. Not true. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 10:18:27 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by R30A on Thu Apr 9 00:39:28 2015. Maybe wayside infrastructure has changed since the day of the M3, or may hap the tracks were moved a little to reduce the gaps.ROAR |
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| (1347180) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 10:23:31 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by steamdriven on Wed Apr 8 19:36:18 2015. The width problem is not at the platform level, It is the bulging belt that is causing the concern. The bulging belt of the M9 was clearly put there to accommodate the bulging belt of its customers.Gaps on the LIRR are not set to accommodate pax cars, but rather freight cars which NYCT has not many of. The pax cars are onger and so have more end and belly overhang on curves, but even on the straight (if any straights can be found on Long Island) some door appliance not properly dogged or mayhap a wider load can a problem cause. ROAR |
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| (1347182) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by r30a on Thu Apr 9 10:38:20 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 10:18:27 2015. Today is the day of the M3. |
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| (1347184) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 11:01:04 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by r30a on Thu Apr 9 10:38:20 2015. But is it used on all branches? Has it been excluded from one. Things change.ROAR |
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| (1347192) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Thu Apr 9 12:42:55 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Mr. MTA on Thu Apr 9 09:11:30 2015. Yes it is true. Just because they are manufactured by different companies doesn't in any way mean that they necessarily can't be compatible. |
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| (1347196) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by r30a on Thu Apr 9 13:03:02 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 11:01:04 2015. All branches which see M7s see M3s and will see M9s. |
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| (1347198) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by AndrewN42 on Thu Apr 9 13:41:58 2015, in response to LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by R36 #9346 on Wed Apr 8 10:10:46 2015. Maybe they pulled it because people were wondering why it's being manufactured in Japan instead of Yonkers?They could be building the test units in Japan while they're readying Yonkers for mass production... though it could be easier to say nothing than try to instill reason in people. |
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| (1347199) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Wado MP73 on Thu Apr 9 13:53:54 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Mr. MTA on Thu Apr 9 09:11:30 2015. One example: M2, M4 and M6 were manufactured by different car builders are mixed in the same consist. |
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| (1347201) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by randyo on Thu Apr 9 14:36:49 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Apr 8 17:20:24 2015. Still no excuse. That is poor railroad management. The ideal situation would be to have all rolling stock fully compatible with all other rolling stock on a given transit property. That was the principal behind the operation of the IND until the R-190s came along and when eventually the IRT became 100% SMEE trains were able to operate in mixed trains of all equipment from the R-12s through the R-36s. |
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| (1347202) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by randyo on Thu Apr 9 14:44:02 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Apr 9 07:17:48 2015. I agree. When the City of NY took over the IRT and BMT there were 3 separate sets of operating rules, signaling and other variations and eventually they all fell under one universal set of operating rules under the B of T and eventually the NYCTA. The inability LIRR and M/N to operate joint service between the twos no different from the inability of the BMT/IND and IRT to operate joint service. |
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| (1347203) | |
Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by randyo on Thu Apr 9 14:47:14 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Wado MP73 on Thu Apr 9 13:53:54 2015. Not only that, but as I alluded to in another post on equipment compatibility the R-1s through 9s were manufactured by various car builders and were all fully compatible as was the case with the BMT steels and the IRT Lo-Vs as well as the IRT postwar equipment. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Thu Apr 9 14:51:18 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by randyo on Thu Apr 9 14:36:49 2015. Huh? THEY DON'T WANT THEM TO BE COMPATIBLE. And I'd bet there are good reasons for it. So who are you to claim that it is an excuse or poor management? |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 15:05:29 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by r30a on Thu Apr 9 13:03:02 2015. LION knows knot. him just repeat the things herd on this thread.GRRR |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 15:06:44 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by AndrewN42 on Thu Apr 9 13:41:58 2015. The prototypes are always built in Japan. Once the design all fits together and it goes into serial production it will be in the YONKERS.ROAR |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by milantram on Thu Apr 9 15:12:19 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 15:06:44 2015. Won't they be assembled in Lincoln, NE first? |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by pragmatist on Thu Apr 9 15:19:01 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 15:06:44 2015. Federal funded acquisitions are mostly "buy American" NYS acquisitions give extra weight to "NY content" Kawasaki, Alstom, Bombardier, and CAF are in NY for one or both of those reasons. Novabus and now its sister company Prevost are in Plattsburgh, and Orion was in Oriskany the same way. Prototyping can be overseas, depending on the specific contract, it's build and assemble here, or shell comes in by ship and assembly is here. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by randyo on Thu Apr 9 16:03:33 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by terRAPIN station on Thu Apr 9 14:51:18 2015. AsI mentioned in a couple of other posts, the IND R-1s through 9s and all the IRT (and BMT/IND care for that matter) postwar equipment from the R-12s through the R-36s was fully compatible and the contracts for the NYCTA SMEEs actually specified that the cars be fully compatible without all other R types from the R-10s on up. When I was in the schedule office and the R-62s were being discussed, the plan was to also have them fully compatible with all other postwar NYCTA equipment. At my worst, I have a lot more operating and planning experience in the field of mass transit than you will ever have, so that definitely qualifies me to make judgments of that kind!!!!! |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Thu Apr 9 16:06:00 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by AndrewN42 on Thu Apr 9 13:41:58 2015. they won't be made in Yonkers , 14 test cars are made in Kobe Japan. rest will be manufactured inclusive shell at Kawasaki plant in Lincoln Nebraska. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Thu Apr 9 16:06:22 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 15:06:44 2015. no yonkers. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Outside the Box on Thu Apr 9 16:17:01 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Dutchrailnut on Thu Apr 9 07:06:52 2015. Have they ever considered a cabless C type motor trailer? It would add another row or 2 of seats.Considering how widespread laptops are, and the computerization of EMU rail cars, isn't it feasible to come up with a removable control console for cabless EMU car for when one needs to take apart consists? |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by pragmatist on Thu Apr 9 16:58:05 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Dutchrailnut on Thu Apr 9 16:06:00 2015. I know things could have changed and I would not be shocked, but when the deal was originally done, the Governor sent out press releases featuring the impact on employment in Yonkers. These days, nothing would surprise me. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Dutchrailnut on Thu Apr 9 17:21:09 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by pragmatist on Thu Apr 9 16:58:05 2015. Yonkers will only do warranty work, but with all subway cars and M-7 - M-7a - M-8 M-9 M-9a those boys sure won't be getting less work. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 17:28:18 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by pragmatist on Thu Apr 9 16:58:05 2015. Politicians are like reporters. They do not know shit and could care less.ROAR |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by steamdriven on Thu Apr 9 17:47:24 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Broadway Lion on Thu Apr 9 10:23:31 2015. "The bulging belt of the M9 was clearly put there to accommodate the bulging belt of its customers."--- Chuckle. And true. I'm sure I don't understand all the issues involved, but if the freights are wider, then why not make the pax car about as wide as the freights, and shave back whatever branch line/oddball platforms don't fit ?? Curves mess things up, so just deal with large gaps at those platforms along curves: Post skull'n crossbones with an helpful informative pic of an oblivious customer falling through the gap, with the below platform diagram showing a Cuisinart and an electric spark, for the benefit of tourists and out-of-towners. How many platforms are on curves anyway? It's possible to make a very tough hollow plastic gap filler a few inches wide, which would just clear a normal train while not damaging stuff if the train rocks or an over-width freight comes through. Of course, MTA would probably not bother to make it non-slippery when wet. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Apr 9 17:52:41 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Dutchrailnut on Wed Apr 8 20:52:20 2015. The tightest clearance is on the Atlantic Branch entering and leaving the western most tunnel. Maybe the M-9 has to be banned from running there ? |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Apr 9 18:03:16 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by Wado MP73 on Thu Apr 9 13:53:54 2015. But MN would never mix an M-1 with an M-3. |
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Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan |
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Posted by Joe V on Thu Apr 9 18:05:12 2015, in response to Re: LIRR Leaks Photo of M9 car in Japan, posted by WillD on Thu Apr 9 07:49:45 2015. I always thought the M-8 looked like a Class 319. |
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