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| Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth (775421) | |
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| (779796) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun May 3 13:11:05 2009, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Fred G on Sun May 3 12:52:51 2009. Computer? No. Technology? Yes. Once a film photograph is developed, the only thing needed to view if for as long as it exists is the Mark I eyeball. Between "Life After People" and "Battlestar Galactica", I've seen enough scenerios where we could lose the technological knowledge that allows digital photography to exist. If that happens, it's all gone. Forever. Digital photography is predicated on the concept that prints can be made repeatedly, so long-term quality is never an issue. I still have pics of my great grandmother which were taken 100 years ago. |
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| (779830) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Fred G on Sun May 3 13:48:41 2009, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun May 3 13:11:05 2009. And a printed digital photo only needs an eyeball to view it.your pal, Fred |
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| (779832) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Fred G on Sun May 3 13:53:19 2009, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun May 3 13:11:05 2009. Not to mention that you need a darkroom with chemicals to process a film photo.your pal, Fred |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (1165506) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jul 7 23:01:53 2012, in response to More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Apr 24 22:52:40 2009. This one credited to "miningcamper" dated December 1963. FM TrainMaster on a commuter train. Now two from John Dziobko, the godfather himself. First one shows a B&O passenger train going over the Linden Road crossing (the caption says "Elmora" station, but that's the wrong location; the station here would be Lorraine station in Roselle and Roselle Park). Date is April 1958.  Second one shows the RDG's Crusader on October 7, 1950 with the two diesels; same location (Linden Road crossing). Difference in signaling is quite evident.  |
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| (1165531) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Sun Jul 8 08:36:31 2012, in response to More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Apr 24 22:52:40 2009. Now those would indeed be worth a trip to Elizabeth to see. Too bad that line didn't hang on. If that line stayed in service, it would make for some much better railfanning at Elizabeth. |
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| (1165534) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jul 8 09:10:36 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Sun Jul 8 08:36:31 2012. No MLVs though have to draw the line somewhere . . .
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| (1165536) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by kp5308 on Sun Jul 8 09:22:57 2012, in response to More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Apr 24 22:52:40 2009. Thanks for posting!That lead FP7 survives today & is at Steamtown. You should go pay a visit. Shot in 2007 with 903:  |
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| (1165591) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Sun Jul 8 16:08:12 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Apr 25 02:55:42 2009. If the Pensy controlled the B&O from 1901, why did the Pensy oppose the Narrows tunnel, between Staten Island and Brooklyn, that would have connected the Pensy controlled LIRR to the B&O? NY Gov Al Smith, also "controlled" by the Pensy, killed off the project. |
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| (1165592) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Jul 8 16:15:12 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Apr 25 02:55:42 2009. "Maybe you forgot the PRR, at the time these photos were taken, was controlling the B&O?"Not. PRR control ended before 35mm still photography started. And as to Royal Blue service to Penn that was courtesy USRA. |
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| (1165609) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jul 8 18:46:01 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Jul 8 16:15:12 2012. And as to Royal Blue service to Penn that was courtesy USRAHow do you explain LVRR service to Penn then . . . ? |
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| (1165623) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Joe V on Sun Jul 8 19:13:28 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jul 8 18:46:01 2012. Pennsy had some percentage of financial ownership of the LV |
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| (1165625) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by kp5308 on Sun Jul 8 19:15:27 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jul 8 18:46:01 2012. How do you explain LVRR service to Penn thenVested interest thru Pennroad. IIRC PRR thru Pennroad held around 90% of LV stock. |
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| (1165627) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jul 8 19:24:41 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by kp5308 on Sun Jul 8 19:15:27 2012. I can't find the date when the PRR no longer owned the B&O. You know offhand? |
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| (1165639) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Dave on Sun Jul 8 19:53:24 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jul 8 19:24:41 2012. The C&O took control in 1963. |
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| (1165640) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Jul 8 20:01:54 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Dave on Sun Jul 8 19:53:24 2012. Before WWI. probably concurrent to NYC selling off NKP. Sherman, Clayton Acts. |
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| (1165652) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Dave on Sun Jul 8 20:58:56 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Jul 8 20:01:54 2012. Not according to wikipedia:Following its emergence from bankruptcy, control of the B&O was acquired by the Pennsylvania Railroad in 1901. A rising young PRR Vice President, Leonor F. Loree, was appointed President. Loree shared the Pennsy management's belief in infrastructure and the B&O at that time needed some of that. New classes of engines were built to haul longer, heavier trains faster. The Old Main Line was reworked, sections of the original right-of-way cut off by the straightening of curves and replacement of old, weight-restricted bridges with newer, heavier bridges. Most of Loree's work on the B&O physical plant remains evident today. Many iron and steel bridges on the railroad were replaced with stone (Pennsy preferred stone to the preference of the Reading and Lackawanna Railroad for concrete). The Chesapeake and Ohio Railway took financial control of the B&O in 1963. |
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| (1165687) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Jul 8 23:12:35 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Dave on Sun Jul 8 20:58:56 2012. Speaking as a stockholder of B&O and successors since 1960, I am well aware of the date of C&O control. That does not change the fact that B&O was NOT a PRR holding in the 20's. Loree was a good steward of our RR and you can see his influence in the E 24 2-8-0's which had Belpaire fireboxes (not repeated). I reiterate that PRR control was short lived and ended before WWI. The access to Penn Station was USRA policy along with cutting B&O sleepers from the west. The lease of space was renewed in 1920, but when close to expiration B&O was given notice. Pres Willard was able to negotiate a one year extension, but that was it. Bottom line yes B&O was briefly under PRR control, but that ended a century ago. |
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| (1165714) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Dave on Mon Jul 9 07:59:41 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sun Jul 8 23:12:35 2012. Are you talking about operational control or financial control? |
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| (1165717) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by kp5308 on Mon Jul 9 09:11:45 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jul 8 19:24:41 2012. I can't find the date when the PRR no longer owned the B&O. You know offhand?Not offhand but I come up with mid-1904 this way: According to the Harwood Royal Blue Line book, PRR was feeling antitrust heat & backed off the B&O control soon after Loree resigned. Acoording to THIS Loree left the B&O on January 1 1904. |
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| (1165735) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jul 9 12:12:18 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Dave on Mon Jul 9 07:59:41 2012. not sure what you are asking. Once C&O had the stock tenders they began leasing old C&O cars/engines to B&O. Once ICC authority was assured the game was over. |
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| (1165743) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jul 9 13:23:28 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by kp5308 on Mon Jul 9 09:11:45 2012. for reference the B&O timeline site has a large number of errors or inaccuracies. I say this from the perspective of a life long B&O fan with reference materials of greater accuracy in my library. |
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| (1165767) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by kp5308 on Mon Jul 9 14:43:56 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jul 9 13:23:28 2012. I say this from the perspective of a life long B&O fan with reference materials of greater accuracy in my library.Can you help us out with this? |
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| (1165771) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jul 9 15:01:44 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by kp5308 on Mon Jul 9 14:43:56 2012. So what are you looking for? For instance someone in this thread quote Herb Harwood's excellent history of the Royal Blue line; a copy is in my library read once through on acquisition and where I looked last night for confirmation of the Penn Station details. My Official Guide collection does not cover anything pre WWII although I have at least one public TT from then. As to critiquing the timeline site I was particularly annoyed by what I consider sloppiness in his dating of steam engines where he confused rebuilt classes with their antecedents. References for better dating two books on B&O engines which also have some errors but are at least far better.Full set of B&ORRHS pub The Sentinel which is pretty accurate. |
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| (1165803) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by kp5308 on Mon Jul 9 19:30:55 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Jul 9 15:01:44 2012. So what are you looking for?When PRR gave up the control of the B&O. It appears the stock was sold in bunches over a period of years. |
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| (1165848) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by JRice on Tue Jul 10 07:58:51 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jul 7 23:01:53 2012. That scheme was perfect for the TrainMasters! Great pics! |
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| (1165994) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by 3-9 on Tue Jul 10 23:01:08 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jul 8 09:10:36 2012. Great picks of pics, thanks! |
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| (1166004) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Wed Jul 11 00:28:39 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by JRice on Tue Jul 10 07:58:51 2012. I agree.Mind you, one friend of mine also thinks that the CNJ ought to have invested in gallery cars; but that would have necessitated razing the high platforms at Elizabethport and Cranford. They would have matched up well with the Trainmasters though (especially since Southern Pacific ran gallery cars with those locomotives) . . . and maybe it would have been a disincentive to instituting the Aldene Plan, as well as been more popular than the single-level P54s that the PRR was running down the shore back then 
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| (1166409) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Fri Jul 13 09:41:18 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Jul 8 09:10:36 2012. Cmon now, them MLVs ain't so bad at all!!! :-D |
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| (1166482) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 13 18:11:17 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Jul 7 23:01:53 2012. Why is there a baggage car on a commuter train? |
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Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jul 13 18:13:29 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 13 18:11:17 2012. I've done those trains to Monmouth. If that's the same as what I rode, there's a generator in there for lights in the coaches. CNJ was a shittier railroad than the Erie Lackamoney. :( |
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| (1166486) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 13 18:19:46 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jul 13 18:13:29 2012. The Trainmaster had a steam generator, and the CNJ's coaches were designed to be powered by steam. There was no need for a generator car. |
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Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jul 13 18:31:53 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 13 18:19:46 2012. Lights. Most of the lights in the cars lit. And the generator in there was running every time I rode. |
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| (1166497) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 13 19:15:02 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jul 13 18:31:53 2012. Wouldn't the steam generators provide the electricity for the lights as well? Even the original GP40's the CNJ got in 1968 had a steam generator for these older cars. |
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Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jul 13 19:20:32 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 13 19:15:02 2012. Maybe like the rest of the railroad, it was no longer working. All I can tell ya is I heard a diesel running in there whenever that baggage car was behind the loco. Often the train had a geep on the point. |
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| (1166503) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Fri Jul 13 19:53:07 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Fri Jul 13 18:11:17 2012. same reason CB&Q had a single level semi lightweight on the early gallery commuter trains--diesel generator for lights/AC I remember seeing these in 1960 |
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Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by merrick1 on Fri Jul 13 20:10:29 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jul 13 19:20:32 2012. Steam was for heat.According to "The Second Diesel Spotter's Guide" CNJ had GP9s with train lighting equipment housed in an extension of the long hood. CNJ also had GP40Ps with an extension of the long hood which housed the steam generator and electrical equipment for train lighting. The book does not say if the train lighting equipment was powered by the prime mover or if there was a separate diesel engine driving a generator. I can remember GP40Ps in service and I never noticed the sound of a separate diesel engine running. Apparently the FM Trainmasters where not equipped to provide electricity for train lighting and a baggage car with a generator was used. |
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Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Jul 13 20:22:23 2012, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in or near Elizabeth, posted by merrick1 on Fri Jul 13 20:10:29 2012. That'd be my guess too ... but occasionally, there'd be a geep with one of those in the consist as well and it was honking and smoking. Wasn't all that often they'd toss one of those cars in, but when they did it was running. |
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Re: Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Dec 21 22:49:23 2012, in response to Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Apr 24 22:18:06 2009. Here's a pic of a westbound Capitol Limited. Mr. Gavin dated it February 18, 1963, which is most likely a typo (probably 1953). |
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Re: Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ |
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Posted by chud1 on Sat Dec 22 04:53:59 2012, in response to Re: Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Dec 21 22:49:23 2012. 5 stars out of 5 stars on that beauty.it is to foam. chud1 |
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| (1193735) | |
Re: Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Dec 22 11:13:01 2012, in response to Re: Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ, posted by chud1 on Sat Dec 22 04:53:59 2012. That's back when the Northeast Corridor (in the background) had some real competition. |
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| (1193741) | |
Re: Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Dec 22 12:03:54 2012, in response to Re: Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Dec 21 22:49:23 2012. 2 digit # on diesel before 1956 renumbering + all service on route ended April 1958 |
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| (1193765) | |
Re: Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ |
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Posted by 3-9 on Sat Dec 22 14:16:36 2012, in response to Re: Color Photo of B&O National Limited at CNJ Broad Street, Elizabeth NJ, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Dec 21 22:49:23 2012. The color got faded out a little, but it's still a nice, sharp pic! Thanks for sharing! |
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| (1286853) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Apr 21 21:35:52 2014, in response to More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Apr 24 22:52:40 2009. Got sent this, which is hosted on FB. Only have the year, which is 1940. Westbound train; PRR train visible on viaduct, and old PRR Elizabeth station building also visible in background on right-hand side. |
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| (1286878) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by chud1 on Tue Apr 22 04:52:34 2014, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Apr 21 21:35:52 2014. EXCELLENT!chud1. :).... |
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| (1290376) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon May 12 15:28:19 2014, in response to More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Apr 24 22:52:40 2009. Photographer unknown; posted by one Liz Brodowski in an Elizabeth NJ-themed group. Year cited as 1967. |
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| (1290408) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by chud1 on Mon May 12 17:55:08 2014, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Mon May 12 15:28:19 2014. Cool!chud1. :).... |
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| (1290409) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by chud1 on Mon May 12 17:55:08 2014, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Mon May 12 15:28:19 2014. Cool!chud1. :).... |
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| (1290448) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon May 12 21:14:37 2014, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Mon May 12 15:28:19 2014. Bigger version of same. |
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| (1290455) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon May 12 22:31:45 2014, in response to Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Mon May 12 21:14:37 2014. And not Liz; Ellen. Sorry about that. |
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| (1318501) | |
Re: More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Oct 13 22:57:49 2014, in response to More trains on the CNJ main in Elizabeth, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Apr 24 22:52:40 2009. This one's at the Broad Street station in March of 1968, post-Aldene. Still quite busy with freight. Don't know photographer's name. |
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