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| Re: 76st what happened? (1030985) | |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by DHeese810 on Sat Feb 5 01:34:43 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by monorail on Sat Feb 5 01:29:56 2011. Yea, I agree with this...One of the TA employees on this fantastic forum should take one of those keyhole cameras, discussed earlier here and just stick it through the hole in the cinderblock wall. Minimally invasive and it should get the job done.-Dan |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by SMAZ on Sat Feb 5 02:13:22 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Elkeeper on Fri Feb 4 20:02:44 2011. A lot of IND work ended in 1936. My guess is funding problems.A lot of WPA money was cut in 1937 (triggering a recession) so annual payments were probably less in subsequent years. They may have gone back to the drawing board after '36 and things got delayed. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 05:39:39 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Fri Feb 4 17:45:19 2011. Get one thing straight. The cinderblock walls were erected ONLY at the ends of A 7 and A8 Yard leads NOT at the end of the mainline Fulton St subway!!!! |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 05:43:13 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by sloth on Fri Feb 4 19:17:41 2011. Where are the maps of the EXACT areas we are talking about? All the maps you seem to show are nowhere near the So Ozone Park area of 76/Pitkin!!!! |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 05:51:14 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by tunnelrat on Fri Feb 4 19:31:21 2011. Actually, the A3 and A4 track that stub ended at Rocky Ave ended at about what would be the 8 or 9 car stop marks at the local tracks of the Rocky Av station. There are two places at approximately those locations on the express tracks where the bumping blocks were located and instead of concrete roadbed, there were type one ties there. the short type one section is still there. The "temporary wooden platforms extended a bit into the tunnel where tracks A1 and A 2 would have been. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 05:53:54 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Feb 4 17:12:05 2011. Actually, based on the economic conditions of the times, I find it very easy to believe. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 05:58:39 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Fri Feb 4 17:23:06 2011. The only difference was that after unification in 1941, using Rocky Ave as a terminal provided a transfer from the IND to the remainder of the Fulton St el. The 76 St location while a station on the way to a farther terminal by itself, would have served no useful purpose. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 06:02:34 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by SMAZ on Sat Feb 5 02:13:22 2011. As I mentioned in several posts, there were several options for the IND to continue past Rocky Av and the final route had probably not been finalized at the time Rocky Av was finished in 1936! |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 06:06:07 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by tunnelrat on Fri Feb 4 20:23:22 2011. It would have been 6 tracks only N/O 76 St and the track locations N/O the bulkhead bear this out, but the 76 St station itself would only have been 4 tracks wide sort of like Shepherd Ave. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Feb 5 06:38:08 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by sloth on Fri Feb 4 19:17:41 2011. 76th street is like the existence of god.No, it's not. No-one's claiming that 76th Street is immanent and transcendent; they're claiming it's in Queens. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Feb 5 06:42:37 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by 3-9 on Sat Feb 5 00:36:26 2011. If this was a myth that was being propagated, I would expect more differences, yet the descriptions are remarkably similar.But that is the other point: the similarities are largely trivial, because of the complete lack of originality in the design of IND local stations. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Feb 5 06:43:19 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 05:39:39 2011. Yes. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Joe Saitta on Sat Feb 5 07:00:52 2011, in response to 76st what happened?, posted by tunnelrat on Fri Jan 28 13:58:35 2011. Has anyone ever considered doing research of back copies of the Long Island Daily Press for the years, let's say, 1936 to 1950, at the Queensboro Public Library, which has microfilm records from 1921 to 1977? Also, the Levittown Public Library in Nassau County has microfilm of the this paper from 1944 to 1977. The Press went out of business in 1977 due to an extended pressman's strike. This paper was fairly well-detailed in items that related to Queens and perhaps some of the questions about the subways and their construction that have been asked here could be answered. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 09:03:35 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by DHeese810 on Sat Feb 5 00:43:06 2011. I don`t believe so.The article I,ve got was hand drawn by dave rogoff.the drawing I have is by bernie linder. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 09:06:14 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by DHeese810 on Sat Feb 5 01:34:43 2011. There is no hole in the wall,its 3 blocks thick.the part of the wall I tried digging under ia apparentally back filled with dirt. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 09:09:41 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Joe Saitta on Sat Feb 5 07:00:52 2011. I did,many times.there is no reference to subway construction in that area. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Joe Saitta on Sat Feb 5 12:51:52 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 09:09:41 2011. Thank you for checking the Files of the Long Island Daily Press. But - have you also checked out the back issues of the Howard Beach Herald, the Ozone Park Observer, the Pitkin Planet, the East New York Examiner, the Fulton Free Press, the Glenmore Gazette, the Liberty Ledger, the Euclid Eagle, the Grant Guardian, the Belmont Believer, the Conduit Chronicle, the Crescent City Press, the Atlantic Advance, the Forbell Free Press, the Ruby Recorder, the Eldert Enterprise or the 76th Street Sentinel? |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 5 13:31:16 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by tunnelrat on Fri Feb 4 15:26:01 2011. How would it be hearsay? |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 5 13:32:18 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Randyo on Fri Feb 4 15:32:12 2011. The cemetery is on the ground. The subway station would have been deeper than six feet.IINM the cemetery is on a hill as well. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 5 13:54:27 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Feb 4 15:58:57 2011. I never said that it was impossible. It's just impractical to believe in everything that's possible. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 13:57:27 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Joe Saitta on Sat Feb 5 12:51:52 2011. Well now.I HUMBLELY admit that i,m editor-n-chief&head investgative report of all of those.I,m really good at multi-tasking. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 14:00:15 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 5 13:31:16 2011. Has it been proven that there IS a water problem over there? |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Sat Feb 5 16:17:28 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by SMAZ on Fri Feb 4 13:18:52 2011. WRONG!All you've done is what WE ALL DID. SPECULATE...and state our OPINION on the matter. NONE of us can actually PROVE the station is there,OR NOT,Unless the MTA steps forward..and we KNOW THATS NOT GONNA HAPPEN. so... |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Sat Feb 5 16:25:37 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 05:51:14 2011. Okay, I get it that they ran out of money to finish B'way-East NY station. But, why didn't they build a temporary relay, east of Rockaway Ave. Say from eastbound A1 to A4, returning to A2 for Manhattan bound service? As far as I know, only Ralph and Rockaway Ave's had those wooden walkways to the car doors! |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Sat Feb 5 16:36:00 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Randyo on Fri Feb 4 17:05:04 2011. not only that,but the walkways covered the LOCAL TRACKS at Ralph and Rockaway avenues.. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Feb 5 16:40:13 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Feb 5 06:38:08 2011. Well ... it IS a bit transcendent. :) |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Feb 5 16:43:48 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Joe Saitta on Sat Feb 5 12:51:52 2011. Fookin' CLASSIC! :) |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Edwards! on Sat Feb 5 16:46:44 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Feb 4 09:50:20 2011. Just so YOU KNOW...We're BEYOND CARING about WHAT YOU believe..Y You stated "YOUR OPINION" on the matter..even ridiculed others for NOT sharing YOUR point of view. From the bottom of my heart..STFU!WE HEARD YOU THE FIRST HUNDRED TIMES YOU BITCHED ABOUT IT. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Feb 5 16:49:44 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Feb 5 13:54:27 2011. Just busting ... but the point I was going for is that you have in fact had an act of faith there - believing that something can't exist is the opposite of believing that something does exist whereas the open mind would accept neither extreme without proff ... it's a philosophical thang. :) |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Feb 5 17:13:08 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Feb 5 16:49:44 2011. That's the argument for telling people not to be so silly when they claim there are plesiosaurs in Loch Ness. Somehow, I'm still going to tell them not to be so silly, as it's a far saner assumption that something tangible for which there is no evidence does not exist. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 17:41:24 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Elkeeper on Sat Feb 5 16:25:37 2011. UH,they ran out of money? |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 17:43:41 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Feb 5 17:13:08 2011. nothing but evidence,you choose to ignore it. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 17:53:38 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Randyo on Sat Feb 5 05:39:39 2011. Also, the cinderblock walls were not erected until sometime between 1962 and 1983 so they were not a part of the original cessation of construction. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 17:57:11 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Edwards! on Sat Feb 5 16:36:00 2011. Well, there was also a walkway across the express tracks at the block ends of A3 and A4 like there was at Flatbush IRT before it was changed to concrete. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:08:47 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Fri Feb 4 17:13:53 2011. One of the questions is being asked, however, is what reason would there have been to not complete ENY 6 years before the war started when there was no shortage of construction materials. As I said in another post, I believe that the city had not at the time decided what route the subway would take east of that point and nothing was done until it was decided. With unification, the concept of competition with the private companies was no longer a factor and ease of transfer between and among the 3 divisions of the transit system was now what was being sought thus the decision to build the next station east of Rocky Ave at a location that would provide a transfer to the BMT's Bway Jct was made which required the subway to curve slightly north away from Fulton St under Truxton Pk. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:12:39 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Feb 4 17:14:28 2011. The reason I mentioned the dates is because I believe the current hype about the existence of the station only started less than 10 years ago and I had heard about it long before that. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 18:16:35 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:12:39 2011. I first heard of it in 1964,bernie linder well before that. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:26:58 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Feb 5 06:42:37 2011. However, as far as IND stations go, the stations S/O ENY are different from any other IND stations with the exception of 179 St and 42/8 lower which were all tiled about the same time. 76 St, therefore would be similar in detail to Shepherd Av rather than ,let's say, Rockaway Av. Had the station finish on those stations been completed before WWII like ENY, then they would have been indistinguishable form the rest of the IND. However, for whatever reason, the type of tiles used on postwar construction was different in texture and color from those on prewar stations. The older uncolored tiles were for the most part a pure white whereas the equivalent tiles on the newer stations were an off white sort of ivory color rather than pure white. Most of the prewar tiles also had a high gloss finish whereas the tiles on the postwar stations had a flatter matte finish. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:34:43 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 09:06:14 2011. I don't recall how far the A7 and A8 tunnels went when George and I were there in 1962, but at the ends of the tunnel were mounds of black earth floor to ceiling so that means that the back filling was done before then and the cinder block walls were put up between then and 1983 when we went there next. Why the even left that much of the tunnel infrastructure accessible since the tracks had been removed and they were putting up the cinderblocks anyhow is something I can't figure out. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:38:17 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 18:16:35 2011. So we all initially heard about it around the same time, but I don't recall there being as much hype about it as there has been in recent years. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 18:52:27 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:38:17 2011. No internet back then. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Sat Feb 5 18:53:25 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by 3-9 on Sat Feb 5 00:36:26 2011. I would expect more differences, yet the descriptions are remarkably similar. That's because everyone is quoting the same two or three people. Plus, at least a couple of people claim to have actually SEEN it, No, no one here has ever claimed to have seen it. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by DHeese810 on Sat Feb 5 18:56:24 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by DHeese810 on Sat Feb 5 01:34:43 2011. So, on my way back from school today, I took the A train, stopped at Euclid and knocked on the tower door. Asked the guy if he knew anything about the tracks behind Euclid, in specific A7, A8 etc. He said No :(. Told him to peel back the piece of tape on the model board in Euclid and see what I was taking about :D.Met a T/O on the H Shuttle and asked him about it. He said he's seen the cinderblock wall, the shovel, etc, but has never been behind it or heard about 76th for that matter. He did mention that he'd heard nd seen about like 185th on the QB line something about the 174th yard? Told him the same thing as the Supt at Euclid nd left. Nice guy tho -Dan |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by dtrain1 on Sat Feb 5 19:00:28 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:08:47 2011. Where Truxton Pk is today, weren't there buildings at this site? I am assuming that if there were buildings present in the 1930s the city could have been hung up in the courts condemning all of these properties.? That also could have been eating up a lot of time back then. Just a thought. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Feb 5 19:11:49 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Feb 5 17:13:08 2011. The upstate solution for things like that is usually an eye-roll, accompanied by "would you like another beer?" :) |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by Karl M, Ex New Yorker on Sat Feb 5 19:12:37 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by SelkirkTMO on Fri Feb 4 15:56:15 2011. precisely, the best way to prove or disprove the existence. Karl M |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Feb 5 19:17:06 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:12:39 2011. I'm just messin' with ya ... after all, I heard all about it on the intarwebs back in 1971. Heh. Them damned spiders! :) |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Feb 5 19:18:08 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by randyo on Sat Feb 5 18:38:17 2011. Of course, most of the people who knew about it were only elites paying dues to local 100. :) |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Sat Feb 5 19:22:55 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Karl M, Ex New Yorker on Sat Feb 5 19:12:37 2011. the best LEGAL way. |
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Re: 76st what happened? |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Feb 5 19:25:51 2011, in response to Re: 76st what happened?, posted by Karl M, Ex New Yorker on Sat Feb 5 19:12:37 2011. Us engineer types are annoying that way - we can figure out what is needed for a particular task to work and don't want to hear about what it costs. Just DO it. :) |
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