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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jun 23 13:28:40 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by SLRT on Fri Jun 23 13:16:41 2017. I favor Medicare Advantage. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by SLRT on Fri Jun 23 13:53:40 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Stephen Bauman on Thu Jun 22 22:51:37 2017. No, it's the free market at work, so the question in the case of price gouging for generic drugs is "why aren't any other manufacturers making these drugs?"Answer that and you have the key to destroy Lannett. Maybe if companies of the "socially conscious" model like Paul Neuman helped form drug co-ops instead of salad dressing, something can be done. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jun 23 13:58:25 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Jun 22 20:09:25 2017. No such thing as the government paying for anything; it doesn't produce anything.The costs started to go up from the time the government got into any aspect of medicine; that's on the record. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by 3-9 on Fri Jun 23 15:08:06 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Olog-hai on Fri Jun 23 13:58:25 2017. No such thing as the government paying for anything; it doesn't produce anything.It does produce; but more importantly, it pays for others to produce. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jun 23 15:52:51 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by 3-9 on Fri Jun 23 15:08:06 2017. I think his point is that the government doesn't pay for anything, it's the taxpayers. That doesn't bother me, I can rephrase my previous post to say "taxpayers" instead of "government." |
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Re: Bingbong, answer the question. GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Chicagomotorman on Fri Jun 23 17:50:04 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Chicagomotorman on Thu Jun 22 19:10:49 2017. . |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 18:40:12 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by bingbong on Thu Jun 22 22:04:41 2017. Canada does not have much sprawl like we do. Very few people live in In "rural" ares. That's why they have excellent urban transit systems, but terrible intercity trains and bus service outside of the QC - WIndsor Corridor. There's nothing between their cities.I took a bus from Quebec City north to Le Saugenay last summer. At about the 4 - 6 mile radius, you have warehouses, and beyond that, absolutely nothing for a hundred miles. Ditto on the Montreal - Jonquire train that I took in 2015. Once off Montreal Island, there's nothing but tiny fishing camps and a few cabins until you are in the Saugenay Region, just dirt roads. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 18:41:45 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Stephen Bauman on Thu Jun 22 23:20:53 2017. You know anyone that would give up their Medicare ? I don't. It passed in the mid-1960's with a few Republican votes. Senator Goldwater was screaming and kicking of course. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 18:46:29 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Stephen Bauman on Thu Jun 22 23:20:53 2017. You know anyone that would give up their Medicare ? I don't. It passed in the mid-1960's with a few Republican votes. Senator Goldwater was screaming and kicking of course. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jun 23 18:46:31 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 18:40:12 2017. So? A lot of the United States is like that. Not everything is like the Northeast Corridor megalopolis. While Canada is bigger, much of that land is uninhabitable wasteland. Much US land, by contrast, is in a more hospitable climate.Northern Nevada/Eastern Oregon is very sparsely populated. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 18:52:06 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jun 23 18:46:31 2017. I have taken many cross country trips by train, in the US and Canada over 38 years. They are not the same. We have far more sprawl. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Bill Newkirk on Fri Jun 23 18:56:45 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Joe V on Thu Jun 22 15:54:02 2017. my colonoscopy 3 weeks ago cost me nothing.How about the co-pay ? Bill Newkirk |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by AlM on Fri Jun 23 19:00:45 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 18:52:06 2017. Apples and oranges. You are comparing going north from Montreal or Quebec with going east-west in the US.If you drove the Trans-Canada Highway from Sidney, NS to Vancouver BC, it would not be a massively different experience from driving one of the main US cross-country routes. Along the Trans-Canada is somewhat less populated than going across the US, but not in a major way. Of course, if you get significantly north of the Trans-Canada, you are usually in wilderness, and there's almost nothing. Inhabited Canada is nearly all within 150 miles of the US, with a few exceptions like Edmonton. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by AlM on Fri Jun 23 19:22:39 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jun 23 18:46:31 2017. Last fall I drove over 200 continuous miles within the 48 states, none of it on Interstates, without encountering a traffic light. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 19:41:19 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Bill Newkirk on Fri Jun 23 18:56:45 2017. As I said, not a penny., and I have yet to finish off my deductible. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 19:44:18 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by AlM on Fri Jun 23 19:00:45 2017. I have been on the Canadian as well east of Winnipeg. - that goes east -west Far different than the Empire Builder. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by AlM on Fri Jun 23 20:00:12 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 19:44:18 2017. There's not much between Winnipeg and Sault Ste. Marie, except Thunder Bay. But Winnipeg to Calgary isn't much different from Minneapolis to Billings. In fact, it's probably slightly more heavily populated if anything. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 20:08:50 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by AlM on Fri Jun 23 20:00:12 2017. You won't see strip malls for the first 20 miles out in Canada. You will here. |
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Re: Bingbong, answer the question. GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Chicagomotorman on Fri Jun 23 20:43:36 2017, in response to Re: Bingbong, answer the question. GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Chicagomotorman on Fri Jun 23 17:50:04 2017. Bump |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by bingbong on Fri Jun 23 20:59:24 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Chicagomotorman on Thu Jun 22 19:10:49 2017. Since Sen Kennedy first proposed a Medicare for all phase in in the late 1990s/early 2000s.What we got might have worked, at least as well as it was, had the republicans not withheld the subsidy funds to the insurance companies. It was doing well until that happened. Rates were stabilizing, increases were nearing an inflationary match. Guess even limited success spooked them. I never saw your message. I wasn't avoiding your question. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Chicagomotorman on Fri Jun 23 22:14:46 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by bingbong on Fri Jun 23 20:59:24 2017. OK thank you Bingbong. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by bingbong on Fri Jun 23 22:51:57 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Joe V on Fri Jun 23 19:41:19 2017. There are no copays for screening tests, including colonoscopies, under ACA. If they manage to change it, expect these tests to suddenly become expensive. And the deaths from these cancers to rise sharply, and quickly. Repealing ACA will kill Americans. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Fri Jun 23 23:01:11 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by bingbong on Thu Jun 22 22:04:41 2017. I googled the percent rural population for both the US and Canada. It's a statistical tie at slightly under 20%.The real question is how did the report define wait time. It was the interval between after the patient was referred by his/her primary care physician to when that patient actually received care from a specialist. It did not mention the wait time to see a primary care physician. Canada has a relative scarcity of specialists, whereas the US has a relative scarcity of primary car physicians. I think wait time to see a primary care physician is a more important indicator. One reason for lower US life expectancy and higher cost per patient is that simple conditions are ignored until they become major. The reluctance to see a primary care physician may be due to cost or primary care physician scarcity in the US. Another problem with the wait time measure in the Canadian study is that while procedures might be medically necessary, they may not be immediately necessary. The primary care physician and the specialist are better judges of what's immediately necessary than the patient or the statistician. If the primary care physician and the specialist were not correct in assessing what's what's medically necessary vs. what's immediately necessary, then Canadian life expectancy would not be higher than the US. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by bingbong on Fri Jun 23 23:37:29 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by SLRT on Fri Jun 23 13:16:41 2017. It's extremely costly. Also, it wouldn't exist in a single payer world. There would be no need or point to it. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by bingbong on Fri Jun 23 23:44:52 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Stephen Bauman on Fri Jun 23 23:01:11 2017. Thank you for that last paragraph. It clearly explains why the entire RW argument is bogus, as there are many reasons why treatment can and sometimes should be delayed.Delays in seeing that first doctor, where problems get discovered and assessed are far more of a risk to outcome than anything else. Yes, Canada actually is getting it. That's why their outcomes are better than ours, even though we may have better technologies against dieases such as cancer. Catching cancer early is the best course for anyone, with any variety of cancers, alone it and only it help ensure survival. That tends to happen in your internist's or primary care doctor's office. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 24 06:55:44 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by bingbong on Fri Jun 23 22:51:57 2017. I don't have ACA, but the law affected many other plans.Those who oppose ACA and have other insurance are too dumb to realize it will affect them negatively. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 24 06:58:00 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by bingbong on Fri Jun 23 23:44:52 2017. The RW basically regard health insurance as a divine privilege for the well to do. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by R2ChinaTown on Sat Jun 24 07:49:59 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 24 06:55:44 2017. I think that ACA principles should be incorporated in all insurance. I'd prefer not to carry flood insurance. But living on an island, it would be comforting to know that if there ever was a storm surge that did significant property damage, I could rush out and buy a policy that would cover me. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Jun 24 08:06:17 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by R2ChinaTown on Sat Jun 24 07:49:59 2017. Fine, but then you'd have to accept that insurance would be mandatory or a fine would issue. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Sat Jun 24 08:43:02 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by SLRT on Fri Jun 23 13:53:40 2017. the question in the case of price gouging for generic drugs is "why aren't any other manufacturers making these drugs?The return on investment (ROI) is too low. |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by ChicagoMotorman on Sat Jun 24 09:08:46 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by bingbong on Fri Jun 23 20:59:24 2017. How was Kennedy's proposal different from Hillary care? |
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Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill |
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Posted by bingbong on Sat Jun 24 13:50:25 2017, in response to Re: GOP Senators Reveal Health Bill, posted by Joe V on Sat Jun 24 06:58:00 2017. Which is ROFLMAO!!! seeing as how most of em aren't close to rich, generally have poor health habits and aren't interested in educating themselves and changing thing one WRT. |
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