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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:41:44 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Edwards! on Mon Jun 6 01:27:57 2011. I love this rock. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:42:22 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Edwards! on Mon Jun 6 01:32:37 2011. That was my point. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 01:43:53 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:34:25 2011. I don't think there is really that much of a difference in income and crime between the two sides of the SIE. I think Forest Avenue is a more prominent dividing line. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 01:47:03 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:41:10 2011. You're right that that's a problem. Christopher Lane is a more direct connection between the two neighborhoods, but the problems is that it is one-way (and, unfortunately, it often gets traffic jams by Victory Blvd) |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 01:49:47 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Edwards! on Mon Jun 6 01:27:57 2011. In which you would be wrong too. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:53:16 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 01:43:53 2011. I suggest you look at police reports, and look for the words 'Ada Drive', 'Amador St', and 'Birch Rd'. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:54:06 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 01:47:03 2011. Those jams are due to the poor connection from the unfinished highway to Victory Blvd. the DOT has no plans to remediate that. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:54:43 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 01:49:47 2011. Not nearly as wrong as you've been proven to be. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 01:55:22 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 00:35:14 2011. How far is The Teleport from Goethals? As you know, I also think that it could be served better, JAzumah posted a good proposal years ago on this topic, but I forgot exactly what he said. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 01:56:27 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:54:43 2011. More than how right I was proven to be. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 02:02:39 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 01:55:22 2011. It's around a 2 mile drive from the Goethals Bridge to the Teleport. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 02:04:24 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 02:02:39 2011. I meant Goethals Road. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 02:06:13 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:53:16 2011. I've been around all of those areas and I've felt perfectly safe. Plus, weren't most of those incidents things like domestic disputes and people carrying unlicensed weapons, rather than things like robberies and burgalaries (basically, crimes that can affect people in the surrounding area)? |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 02:06:57 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 02:04:24 2011. It's about a mile, give or take. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 02:36:34 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 01:56:27 2011. You're quite delusional. Don't let me disuade you from that notion. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 02:39:29 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 02:06:13 2011. A crime rate is a crime rate. There were a few drug houses raided in the area of Amador. Not that it doesn't exist elsewhere out here, but it's enough to get the community to come down avaunt such an idea. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 02:48:37 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 02:39:29 2011. Have there been any meetings on the plan to construct the pedestrian bridge? Were there any complaints from the community on the southern side of the SIE? |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 03:06:02 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 02:48:37 2011. There is no plan; I'm saying any plan would be vehemently opposed by the community on the south side of the expressway. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Mon Jun 6 07:01:17 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 01:41:44 2011. Me too!!! |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 08:47:12 2011, in response to Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jun 2 16:24:33 2011. I like your plan Osmosis but after reading some of Hank's and checkmate's post, I would have to agree that SI service is better off as a grid like the rest of the city rather than like Long Island Bus with multiple routes on 1 street going to different places. The ridership would not justify having two or three buses following each other for most of the route as the schedules would have to follow the ferry's schedules. I would rather have more & steady limited service between major points on Staten Island on the busier routes.Here's my version of a SI "fantasy" map:  All of the North Shore routes have more than enough room to grow and run more frequently. Off-peak, 30 minute limited service on the S90, S96 & S98 should be introduced for ferry riders and 15 or 20 minute headways for local service. S53 - Service reduced to make way for S63 to Mariner's Harbor via Victory Blvd & S83 limited to Port Richmond. S54 - Weekend service restored but only between Seaview Hospital & West Brighton. S59 - Extended to St George via Richmond Terrace. Part-time extension to Tottenville eliminated. (School trippers would still cover the S59 to Tottenville.) S61 - Eliminated. Replaced by S91 service. S63 - New route between Brooklyn & Mariner's Harbor using Victory Blvd, Watchogue Rd, Richmond Av & Forest Av. This route would take a significant amount of ridership off of the S53 & S62. S83 - New S53 limited to Port Richmond. S90 - New limited stop at Bard Avenue. S91 - Local between SI Mall & Bradley/Victory, limited on Victory Blvd. S93 - Extended to Richmond/Victory. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Mon Jun 6 09:05:48 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 08:47:12 2011. You should really have the S83 Limited bypass Arrochar, and run along the S79 after Hylan/Clove non-stop to Brooklyn.Also, the S93 extension to Richmond/Victory is a bad idea for reasons I've stated umpteenth times. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 09:23:46 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Mon Jun 6 09:05:48 2011. The only stops in south beach would be at Sand Lane/McClean & School Rd/McClean.And the S93 extension is only an idea, as I do agree that traffic can get very heavy over there at times. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Mon Jun 6 10:41:55 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 09:23:46 2011. In Arrochar the S53 goes through some narrow streets and from Hylan/Clove to the bridge approach the time it can take can sometimes be an eternity with all the meandering. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 10:46:51 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 02:36:34 2011. Don't let yourself think that I care. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 10:58:46 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 08:47:12 2011. Only the South Shore part of my plan would really be like that but thanks for putting up your own map.There's not much about your map that I disagree with. I'd just extend the S63 to Arlington, and reroute that S91 to the Todt Hill Houses. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank Eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 11:15:24 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 10:46:51 2011. I don't think you know how. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 13:05:56 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Mon Jun 6 10:41:55 2011. I would say that stretch from the School Rd to Hylan/Clove on a good day only takes 5-6 minutes but during rush hours it could take 15 minutes. I would have the S83 cut through Arrochar so that it wouldn't duplicate the S93's route and also have sustaining ridership because the S93s never get crowded like the S53. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Mon Jun 6 13:26:02 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 13:05:56 2011. You could have the S83 operate along the S53 to Hylan/Clove and then operate along the S79s route non-stop to Brooklyn afterwards. Therefore the S83 would still be making S53 stops but bypass the area in which service hits a snag the most in Arrochar. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Jun 6 16:21:39 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 01:49:47 2011. I couldnt be wrong...I used those buses damn near EVERYDAY to keep from driving..[let someone else deal with the traffic]..some of your ideas are cool. others?..not so much. relax..listen to some of us who delt with this on a daily..and you'll get an idea of what truly going on.. ok? |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 16:47:08 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Edwards! on Mon Jun 6 16:21:39 2011. Alright. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 21:02:49 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 08:47:12 2011. Like I said, before, the S63 (or possibly the S93) should be extended to serve Goethals Road North for network coverage.I think that the S54 should be extended to St. George instead of the S59. I think the S54 and S91 should be switched, with the S54 taking Manor Road->Victory Blvd->Bradley Avenue->Brielle Avenue, and the S61 taking Victory Blvd->Manor Road->Brielle Avenue->Bradley Avenue->Harold Street. That way, the Todt Hill Houses get direct service to the SI Mall and St. George, and the S54 would serve another shopping district (Victory Blvd). By the way, have you seen my S46 split proposal? |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 21:07:00 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank eisenstein on Mon Jun 6 03:06:02 2011. The area on the southern side of the SIE seems similar in character to the area north of the SIE, though. It is mostly groups of townhouses that look pretty similar. Further south (south of Lamberts Lane), the character becomes more different (the houses become bigger).I'm sure the southern side sees its share of (relatively minor) incidents. I remember walking home from school and seeing a domestic dispute at one of the homes along Fahy Avenue. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 22:04:30 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 21:02:49 2011. Like I said, before, the S63 (or possibly the S93) should be extended to serve Goethals Road North for network coverage.Network coverage for who? No one lives that way except for the trailer park and Home Depot & Regal are walking distance from Forest/South. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 22:42:06 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Mon Jun 6 22:04:30 2011. Not between Richmond Avenue and South Avenue. There are a whole bunch of residents living there, and there is also a school on Goethals Road North. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by dkupf on Mon Jun 6 23:37:34 2011, in response to Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jun 2 16:24:33 2011. I continue to insist that there is no need for two cross-island bus services in Egbertville and Richmondtown.And, I prefer to keep the S61/91 as is for simplicity. If you wish to use a limited-stop route on Victory Blvd, knowing that it would be limited-stop between the Ferry Terminal and JEWETT AV is a no-brainer. And, shifting the S61/91 to Manor Rd would be detrimental for Bradley Av riders. After all they matter, don't they? I am, however, intrigued with how you would restructure South Av service in Arlington, Mariner's Harbor, and Bloomfield. If there's anyone in Operations Planning reading these posts, remember that the goal is not to "minimize operating cost" but to "MAXIMIZE OPERATING EFFICIENCY". Is there a need for two routes serving Forest Av east of South Av? Maybe. My hypothesis is that S46/96 and S48/98 riders are walking the 1/2 mile between the mall and Forest Av; there must be mitigation. If one route is only needed, which one? if two, which two? After all, getting the public involved in the planning process from the start is a good thing. Remember, OP, if it has to be done, do it right. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 6 23:57:38 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by dkupf on Mon Jun 6 23:37:34 2011. I continue to insist that there is no need for two cross-island bus services in Egbertville and Richmondtown.I don't think that the S54 should go to the Mall either since the S61 already takes care of that, and I can't see Manor Road bringing enough ridership to the route to override the redundancy. Maybe the current alignment, with the new "S79A" mentioned in other posts also running on Giffords Lane during the weekend, is the best. And, I prefer to keep the S61/91 as is for simplicity. If you wish to use a limited-stop route on Victory Blvd, knowing that it would be limited-stop between the Ferry Terminal and JEWETT AV is a no-brainer. And, shifting the S61/91 to Manor Rd would be detrimental for Bradley Av riders. After all they matter, don't they? I think that serving the Todt Hill Houses would be a bigger priority than keeping simplicity, and I don't think that rerouting them through the Todt Hill Houses would cause much confusion after a couple of months when people get used to the new arrangement. The S57 would continue to serve Bradley Avenue, and under my idea at least, Bradley Avenue riders shouldn't walk more than 6 minutes to catch a bus to the ferry anyways. The busiest stops along Bradley Avenue, at Holden Boulevard, and at Harold Street, would also continue to be served. Is there a need for two routes serving Forest Av east of South Av? Maybe. My hypothesis is that S46/96 and S48/98 riders are walking the 1/2 mile between the mall and Forest Av; there must be mitigation. If one route is only needed, which one? if two, which two? After all, getting the public involved in the planning process from the start is a good thing. The S48 is full by the time it gets to South Avenue and Forest Avenue, and packed by the time it gets to Richmond Avenue, I think that my alignment will help alleviate crowds on the S48 and give Forest Avenue riders a better chance at getting a seat in addition to linking the Victory Boulevard corridor with the Forest Avenue shopping area. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Tue Jun 7 00:06:59 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by dkupf on Mon Jun 6 23:37:34 2011. Shifting the S61/S91 to Manor Road would give the Todt Hill Houses direct access to both St. George and the SI Mall. As a compromise, the S54 can be shifted to Bradley Avenue, so each street would have service every 15 minutes.Could you rephrase what you are saying about Mariners' Harbor in the 6th paragraph? What mall are you referring to and what does the S46/S96 have to do with Forest Avenue? |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Tue Jun 7 09:54:30 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Tue Jun 7 00:06:59 2011. Unless either route was to be extended to St. George, I wouldn't want anyone that already uses another & more direct route to be pushed onto the S54 or S57. Those routes aren't frequent at all & it would be a waste for the MTA to run those lines at a shorter headway.Now, what I would do is send the S61 via Manor Road & the S91 via Bradley (or vice versa) and let the S54 & S57 continue to run at their 30-40 minute headways. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by LRG5784 on Tue Jun 7 10:18:58 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Tue Jun 7 00:06:59 2011. Shifting the S61 to Manor Road wouldn't solve the problem as Manor Road north of Victory Boulevard would still lack weekend service, unless you have the S54 off-peak service retained north of Seaview Hospital (including weekends).If you have the S54 operate along Bradley Avenue and Victory Boulevard and resume its regular route north of Manor Road, then you could have the S61 operate along Manor Road full-time, with rush hour S91 service operating along Bradley. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Hank Eisenstein on Tue Jun 7 10:56:44 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by checkmatechamp13 on Mon Jun 6 22:42:06 2011. Since this road runs away from Brooklyn and the ferry, and there's no way to provide for bi-directional service there, passengers will STILL need to walk to/from South or Richmond Ave to go the other way. Waste of money to provide service, not to mention illogical. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Tue Jun 7 10:57:12 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Tue Jun 7 10:18:58 2011. I disagree, if you need to take the S54 north of Manor Road when the S54 isn't running or something to that effect, then you can hop on a bus and transfer to the S53 which will give you a free 2nd transfer. It's not worth the effort at all swapping and changing around the S54 & S57 for the very, very few people that ride those routes. But those here that are simply looking at the SI bus map and don't actually live near those routes think otherwise...Manor Road should get the S61 & S54, while Bradley gets the the S91 & S57. I think that is a very fair trade-off as the S54 and s57 are left as-is, the S61 becomes slightly more useful to people that never had direct ferry access before while the S91 becomes the main Bradley Ave route. In order for this to happen the S91 would have to receive off-peak limited service at the cost of reducing S61 service back to every 20 minutes. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Tue Jun 7 11:04:33 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Tue Jun 7 09:54:30 2011. The S54 would be extended to St. George (and the frequencies would be increased to connect with the ferry). The increased ridership should justify the increased frequencies, so that shouldn't be a problem (maybe a couple of buses could be shifted from the S40, since the S54 would take away some of the slack) |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Tue Jun 7 11:07:07 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by LRG5784 on Tue Jun 7 10:18:58 2011. All S61s would be converted to S91s under my plan (use the S62 for local service).Shifting the S54 to Bradley Avenue would result in more equal service on Manor Road and Bradley Avenue. Bradley Avenue actually does see a similar amount of ridership as Manor Road, except that it is more spread out. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jun 7 11:08:07 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Tue Jun 7 10:57:12 2011. Why not just run it on Manor between Holden and Victory, and Bradley between Holden and Harold? |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Tue Jun 7 11:08:16 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Tue Jun 7 09:54:30 2011. Plus, you have to consider that, even if the S54 continued to terminate at West Brighton, it would be a trade-off: Manor Road gains service to St. George at the expense of Bradley Avenue riders. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jun 7 11:09:34 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Terrapin Station on Sun Jun 5 09:02:45 2011. lmao I just noticed this, thankfully someone already shot Brian Weinberg for making that dumb statement though. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Tue Jun 7 11:11:19 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Hank Eisenstein on Tue Jun 7 10:56:44 2011. So just because the streets are one-way, there should be no service at all in that area? I see a decent number of X17 passengers who are willing to cross the SIE to get to/from their bus stop, so I don't see why it wouldn't work with the S93.In addition, riders from Victory Blvd get easier access to South Avenue, and even if a lot of the ridership doesn't come from the service road, I'm sure people along South Avenue would use it if it were extended to Arlington. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Tue Jun 7 11:12:45 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jun 7 11:08:07 2011. Wagner High School is on Brielle Ave..think of the S54 & S57 as school bus routes because that's honestly what they are.If the S61 or S91 was to serve Todt Hill, the S54 would essentially become useless outside of school hours. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Tue Jun 7 11:13:07 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Tue Jun 7 10:57:12 2011. Giving S61/S91 riders the additional service won't happen because the MTA specifically said that all changes much be cost-neutral. |
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Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k) |
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Posted by checkmatechamp13 on Tue Jun 7 11:14:26 2011, in response to Re: Staten Island Fantasy Map (56k), posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Tue Jun 7 11:12:45 2011. There is actually a decent amount of ridership along Bradley Avenue, for the S57 at least. Plus, the S54 would continue to serve West Brighton, which is a more transit-dependant housing project than Todt Hill. |
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